Archive for the ‘John Crowder’ Category

It took me a few seconds to get into this video, but it is worth while listening.  It is a great exposure of John Crowder.


John Crowder and the rise of the New Mystics.  There is nothing new to what Crowder teaches.  Only that he has found people who are prepared to put up with his strange behaviour.  Even more bizarre is that he has in fact started his own church.  How many comprise his church is unknown.  The fact that there are people willing and open to what he teaches draws some disturbing questions.  The fact that there is no basis for his teachings should make us question why people listen.  The Bible clearly says that in the last days many will depart from the faith and give heed to deceiving spirits.  That time has clearly come upon us.  Tragically  those who believe they can toking the Holy Spirit in the same way as someone can smoke weed shows how far and how deep this deception goes.  Where self seeking pleasure becomes the overwhelming factor in whatever they do.  Their end?  The same as all mystics.  Eventual delusion and frustration.  For the lie  is only good as the act they play out. 

 What we are about to look at is someone who actually things that spiritual drunkenness is OK.  He is also a friend of John Scotland so that should tell you where his article is going.

What is interesting is that the writer continues to change versions which he thinks will aid his cause.  Well I like the King James so I will be quoting from that, the writer like to use the Amplified version which is a favourite of the prosperity teachers. However the Amplified Bible is a very dubious and unpopular version.

 His article starts like this:

 One of the most controversial occurrences in Christianity is people getting “drunk in the Spirit.” Some well-meaning Christians have preached against this manifestation by referring to Scriptures commanding us to “be sober.” Let’s look at some of them…

 His opening volley immediately betrays his dislike of scripture per say.

 “Some well meaning Christians have preached against this manifestation by referring to scriptures commanding us to be sober”

 Where else would anyone go to preach or expose heresy of any kind?  You can almost see this causes him problems because many of these drunken clouts simply do not like to refer to scripture to back up their arguments and we will see why.

 The author quotes these verses:

 “Therefore let us not sleep, as others do, but let us watch and be sober.” – 1 Thessalonians 5:6

 “But let us who are of the day be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love, and as a helmet the hope of salvation.” – 1 Thessalonians 5:8

 “Likewise, exhort the young men to be sober-minded,” – Titus 2:6

 “Therefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and rest your hope fully upon the grace that is to be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ” – 1 Peter 1:13

 “Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour.”- 1 Peter 5:8

 There are different definitions of the word sober found in the Encarta World English Dictionary…

 He proceeds to quote a number of verses which deal with the word sober.  But then he tries to manipulate and tear scripture by redefining it.

 1. Not under the influence of drugs or alcohol

2. Not in the habit of drinking much alcohol or using drugs

3. Serious and thoughtful in demeanor or quality

4. Lacking vitality or brightness in appearance

5. Based on facts and rational thinking rather than on speculation

 Now as you will notice he does not seek to bring in what the word SOBER means in scripture.

1 Peter 5:8 Sober means Vine says Sober, Soberly, Soberminded: signifies “to be free from the influence of intoxicants Strongs says 1) to be sober, to be calm and collected in spirit

2) to be temperate, dispassionate, circumspect

Other wise to be free from any forms of intoxicants

Titus 2:6 SOBER is   1) to be of sound mind a) to be in one’s right mind b) to exercise self-control

1) to put a moderate estimate upon one’s self, think of one’s self soberly 2) to curb one’s passions. be in right mind

 So the word SOBER in just two verses carries with it this idea of being in ones right mind, to curb ones passions,  To be sober calm and collective in the spirit..  Free from intoxicant influences.  It does not say what influences but free from them.

 However as you can see the writer continue to try to muddy the waters by quoting everything but scripture.

 The New Oxford American Dictionary also defines sober is “muted in color” such as a sober gray suit. In this context, being sober would get boring after a while. God likes color and variety.

 He says SOBER means muted in color and being sober would get boring after a while.  God likes color.  Now this is a big departure from scripture.  Again while he tries to quote scripture he really despises it.  Now even from the verses which he himself gives it quite clearly says be sober.  But to the writer this is Boring.  Otherwise the God who inspired the Bible is far too boring.  He wants a god that is full of colour and variety.  Otherwise experience always trumps scripture.  This also tells me that the author of this article is not even saved.  Because the true believer in his soberness has joy unspeakable and full of glory.  It is being obedient to God and being sober that he finds his greatest delight.  Being sober is anything but being “grey suit”.  The dynamics of walking with God is a challenge and a privilege.  Something which I suspect this author knows little of.

 The writer continues:

 Let’s look at 1 Peter 1:13 again from the Amplified Bible…

 “So brace up your minds; be sober (circumspect, morally alert); set your hope wholly and unchangeably on the grace (divine favor) that is coming to you when Jesus Christ (the Messiah) is revealed.”

 Notice in this translation sober is defined as “morally alert.” People under the influence of the Holy Spirit will not do things contrary to the word of God. Once in a while you might see “drunken” Christians do silly things. But as long as those silly things are not sinful, we shouldn’t be too quick to judge these people.

 Now the trouble here is that he says being sober is morally alert then he goes onto say people under the influence will not do things contrary to the word of God.  They might do silly things but as long as they are not sinful we should not be too quick to judge.  Does anyone immediately see the fault here?  Can you see how his reasoning is faulty? He has already assumed that drunkenness is accepted.  As we have seen from both the Strong’s and the Vine that the word SOBER means exactly what it says.  To say that people who are drunk will not do anything wrong is in fact a bare face lie.  WHY?  Because by becoming drunk they are doing things contrary to the word of God.  The Bible forbids drunkenness.  It does not say its OK to be drunk one way but not by another.  How can anyone be “morally alert and circumspect” if they are drunk?

 Let’s look at a few other versions of the Bible to compare

 I Peter 1:13

Therefore,  prepare your minds for action,  keep sober in spirit, fix your hope completely on the grace [to be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ.(NASB)

 Wherefore having girded up the loins of your mind, being sober, hope perfectly upon the grace that is being brought to you in the revelation of Jesus Christ,(Young)

 Therefore gird up your minds, be sober, set your hope fully upon the grace that is coming to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ (RSV)

 While I personally do not necessarily advocate these versions, you can see that the trend in all is “BE SOBER”

 The article goes on to say:

 A few weeks ago, a man emailed me protesting the spiritual drunkenness seen in some of my YouTube videos. He quoted several Scriptures on sobriety using the New American Standard Bible. Let’s compare some of these verses from the NASB with the New King James Version to gain a better understanding of what God’s word is saying…

 1 Corinthians 15:34 in the NASB says, “BECOME SOBER-MINDED AS YOU OUGHT, and stop sinning; for some have no knowledge of God. I speak this to your shame.” The New King James Version reads, “Awake to righteousness, and do not sin; for some do not have the knowledge of God. I speak this to your shame.”

 1 Peter 4:7 (NASB) says, “The end of all things is near; therefore, be of sound judgment and SOBER SPIRIT FOR THE PURPOSE OF PRAYER.” The NKJV reads, “But the end of all things is at hand; therefore be serious and watchful in your prayers.”

 2 Timothy 4:5 (NASB) says, “But you, BE SOBER IN ALL THINGS, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.” The NKJV reads, “But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.”

 People turned off by manifestations of spiritual drunkenness also like to quote 1 Corinthians 14:40, “LET ALL THINGS BE DONE DECENTLY AND IN ORDER.” But a religious person’s idea of “order” may be different from what God’s is. Jeremiah declared, “My heart within me is broken because of the prophets; all my bones shake. I am like a drunken man, and like a man whom wine has overcome, because of the LORD, and because of His holy words.” (Jeremiah 23:9) And as my friend John Scotland points out, “The church began with drunkenness” in Acts chapter 2. There were critics of spiritual drunkenness on the Day of Pentecost as well.

 Now as you can see he keeps changing version and using whatever version will water down his statements, in order to justify drunkenness.  But no matter what version he uses he still cannot get away from the reality that drunkenness is not advocated.  The simple straight forward admonition is to be sober is time after time.  Therefore those who ignore that admonition are being disobedient to God.  Manipulation is easy to spot.” a religious person’s idea of “order” may be different from what God’s is”  He tries to place others as religious and himself as being in Gods corner.  But the very versions he quotes clearly show that he is not in Gods corner at all.

 John Scotland a drunken exponent of this manifestation and a proven heretic says “The church began with drunkenness” in Acts chapter 2. There were critics of spiritual drunkenness on the Day of Pentecost as well

 See how scripture is twisted to say something which it does not sayFirst off all the disciples were not drunk on the day of Pentecost. How do we know that?  Its simple Peter tells us they were not drunk.  It was those who mocked the disciples who said they were drunk. Today those who agree with this stance like the author of this article are the continuation of these mockers.  It is they who criticise and call Peter a liar and boast that the disciples were drunk.  Does anyone believe that it is time for people to start believing Peters testimony?

 One of the main manifestations of drunkenness has been the continual reporting that people like John Scotland are so inebriated they are incapable of preaching from the word.  That’s the act of a drunker, but Peter had no such problem he stood up and preached a message of conviction which brought repentance and salvation to many.

 Let us now look at Galatians 5:22-24…

 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,

23 gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.

24 And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

 One might ask, “Where’s the self-control in a spiritual drunk?” The Amplified Version of Galatians 5:23 reads, “Gentleness (meekness, humility), SELF-CONTROL (SELF-RESTRAINT, CONTINENCE). Against such things there is no law [that can bring a charge].” Continence is defined as “able to control movements of the bowels and bladder” and “exercising self-restraint, esp. sexually.” The Wycliffe New Testament renders Galatians 5:23 as “temperance, continence, chastity; against such things is no law.”

 Again look at how he attempts to get away from the simple rendering of scripture.  The fruit of the Spirit is self-control.  However he tries to muddle this by again quoting from the Amplified version.  But even here it says SELF CONTROL RESTRAINT.  Now he tries to change it to mean control of the bowels.  Why would the fruit of the Spirit give a person the ability to control his bowels?   Fruit of the Spirit is GENTLENESS MEEKNESS HUMILITY…..CONTROLING THE BOWLS!!! 

Sorry that does not quite fit does it?  Anything that takes away the simple rendition that the Holy Spirit brings self-control.  Look at those who are drunk in the so-called spirit?

Do they exercise any of the qualities spoken about in this study?

Do they show forth self-control? Are they able to stand and preach like Peter the word of God?  Do they show forth restrained life?

 Spiritual order what is it?

 1 Cor 14: 40 Let all things be done decently and in order

The idea behind this is that everything should be done decently in arrangement and in order.  Has this ever been the experience of those who profess drunkenness?  Or do they slur their words and fall over?  Do they ramble on about nothing?  Are they incapable of even preaching the word let alone stand?

 1 Thess 5:22 “Abstain from all appearance of evil”

 So do those who fall over and act drunk not give a bad impression to those who are outside of the church?  Will those outside be convinced by this drunkenness, or will they laugh at this foolishness?  I believe we already know that answer.

 The Corinthians church was the very anti type of doing things decently and in order.  There was confusion, heresy, people were taking others to court and especially people were getting drunk at the Love feast.  The Love Fests was a get together, a meal which the church participated in before taking communion.  The feast fell into disorder and was eventually stopped.  Paul spent more time with this church than any other.  Ye this church could boast of having many of the gifts.  But in their manifestation it brought confusion and disorder. 1 cor 13 was written in between Paul’s teaching on the gifts in order to try to instruct this church that LOVE was the paramount basis.  Rather than a competition as to who could prophesy over and above others.


Creation even in a fallen state reveals there is order.  The temple as ordained by God to Moses was constructed according to order. It had to be constructed according to precise detail, the furniture, the curtains, the dimension, all had to be according to exact measurements.  God gifted men with the ability and talents to carry this construction out.   The New Jerusalem is created with an order and purpose.  Everything God does has purpose. 

 1 Cor 14:33 For God is not [the author] of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

Jer 3:25 We lie down in our shame, and our confusion covereth us: for we have sinned against the LORD our God, we and our fathers, from our youth even unto this day, and have not obeyed the voice of the LORD our God

God does not cause confusion but our sins will.

Was Jeremiah a drunkard?

 Jeremiah 23:9 (Matthew Henry)

 He expresses the deep concern that he was under upon this account, and what a trouble it was to him to see men who pretended to a divine commission and inspiration ruining themselves, and the people among whom they dwelt, by their falsehood and treachery (v. 9): My heart within me is broken; I am like a drunken man. His head was in confusion with wonder and astonishment; his heart was under oppression with grief and vexation. Jeremiah was a man who laid things much to heart, and what was any way threatening to his country made a deep impression upon his spirits. He is here in trouble,

 1. Because of the prophets and their sin, the false doctrine they preached, the wicked lives they lived; especially it filled him with horror to hear them making use of God’s name and pretending to have their instruction from him. Never was the Lord so abused, and the words of his holiness, as by these men. Note, The dishonour done to God’s name, and the profanation of his holy word, are the greatest grief imaginable to a gracious soul.

 2. “Because of the Lord, and his judgments, which by this means are brought in upon us like a deluge.’’ He trembled to think of the ruin and desolation which were coming from the face of the Lord (so the word is) and from the face of the word of his holiness, which will be inflicted by the power of God’s wrath, according to the threatenings of his word, confirmed by his holiness. Note, Even those that have God for them cannot but tremble to think of the misery of those that have God against them.

 I think we would have to go a long way to describe Jeremiah’s troubles as akin to these present drunken manifestations.  For them it is a mocking of God, but for Jeremiah such was the concern for what was happening he was broken within.  He saw his fellow Jews turning after false prophets who offered false signs and wonders.  They spoke prophesies which Jeremiah knew were false.  He trembled at their foolishness because he knew what God would do.  His cry was repent and turn back to God, but these people who not to heed Jeremiah’s word.  The verse says “I AM LIKE a drunken man, it does not say he was actually drunk in the spirit.  A drunkard is not someone who is broken in spirit , but someone who is completely the opposite.

 Wesley’s Notes

23:9 Like a man – And he was even astonished and stupefied, and like a drunken man, at the apprehensions of the wrath of the Lord ready to be revealed against them, and considering also what words the holy God had put into his mouth, to speak against them.

Matthew Henry’s Concise Commentary

23:9-22 The false prophets of Samaria had deluded the Israelites into idolatries; yet the Lord considered the false prophets of Jerusalem as guilty of more horrible wickedness, by which the people were made bold in sin. These false teachers would be compelled to suffer the most bitter part of the Lord’s indignation. They made themselves believe that there was no harm in sin, and practised accordingly; then they made others believe so. Those who are resolved to go on in evil ways, will justly be given up to believe strong delusions. But which of them had received any revelation of God, or understood any thing of his word? There was a time coming when they would reflect on their folly and unbelief with remorse. The teaching and example of the true prophets led men to repentance, faith, and righteousness. The false prophets led men to rest in forms and notions, and to be quiet in their sins. Let us take heed that we do not follow unrighteousness.

Does any of this suggest that Jeremiah was somehow under a drunken influence ?  No, but a Holy dread and a fearful apprehension as to what God will do, and if anything this brings a very sobering effect upon those who look on.

 In closing I ought to leave the last word to the author of this article who says:

 In closing, I want to remind my fellow “solution drinkers” to always test the spirits (1 John 4:1). Never assume that all supernatural happenings are from the Lord. People who neglect time studying the Bible are more prone to deception.

 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we SHOULD LIVE SOBERLY, righteously, and godly in the present age.” – Titus 2:12

 If only the author would take his own advice and test the very spirits behind this manifestation.  It is amazing the delusion which encompasses, for he finishes with the word “LIVE SOBERLY” while all the while he advocates to “ LIVE DRUNKENLY”

 1 Cor 5:11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man who is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such a one no not to eat.

 The word for Drunkard means someone who is intoxicated.  Men like John Scotland, Rodney Howard Brown, David Vaughan, John Crowder, Todd Bentley and many more.  When these men describe themselves as intoxicated, the Bible says do not even fellowship with them