My name is John Edwards, and I was a Faith Preacher for ten years and one month. My wife and I attended and graduated from the premiere word of faith seminary in the world. During school I had the opportunity of working for some of the most famous names in the word of faith movement.
We both graduated from school and returned to the Birmingham area and started a charismatic word of faith church in our living room. We had four people at our first service and took up a $300 offering. Over the years, we moved our church to several locations before building our first building on 18 acres of land in Clay, Alabama. Our church had around 300 active members although less than a hundred would attend on any given Sunday. Over all we estimate that we had at least 2,000 members come and go over that ten year period if not more. Charismatic churches we found have extremely high turn over. It was my observation that we would often attract people that had been church members at just about every other charismatic church in town.
I never really liked pastoring because of the politics and constant drama that went on. I loved to teach, visit with people in the hospital, and do the actual work of the ministry, but I hated all the other stuff that goes with it. I stayed frustrated, depressed and I was always discouraged.
As a word of faith Christian, I did all the things that the word of faith teaches. I confessed the Word. I talked in line with the Word. I called things that be not as though they were. I had written out “My Vision” and confessed it out loud almost everyday, all fourteen pages of it. I prayed in tongues for hours. I read books and listened to hundreds, if not to thousands of Cd’s by the prominent word of faith teachers. I went to seminars, revivals, classes and to all sorts of healing meetings, increase meetings, Holy Ghost meetings, Holy laughter meetings and even to numerous early morning prayer meetings. It was a tradition at our church to meet at four in the morning to pray for two hours. For many years I prayed, believed and confessed miracles, signs and wonders for our ministry. But not much happened along those lines. In fact, I buried a lot of people over those years, including my daughter that died of a brain tumor at the age of fourteen. I was constantly perplexed that the message of faith and healing that I was preaching did not seem to work in the lives of the congregation. It seemed like we had all of the same experiences, trials and tribulations as the other church folks around town. I was for sure that there should be a clear distinction between the people of the Word and the denominational people. We had revelation knowledge of the Word. We had a leg up on the Body of Christ. We had the Holy Ghost, prayed in tongues and most of all we had the word of faith message that was full of God’s victory, prosperity and healing power. But there was really no difference between us and them. By them, I am referring to the Baptist, Methodist, Presbyterian, and Assembly of God churches that we as word of faith people thought were missing out. I mocked their teachings and beliefs for years. I learned it from my word of faith teachers and peers. I continued the tradition.
About a year and a half ago and good friend from Tulsa sent me a CD teaching on pride. I hated it. It really bothered me a lot and got me to thinking and praying which is sometimes a dangerous thing to do! I had ministry business to attend to in Indianapolis and in Michigan, so I must have listened to that Cd a dozen times. It convicted me of self. It convicted me of pride. It opened my eyes to some of my motives. More than anything, it revealed to me that I had an enormous ego that could never, ever be content.
I realized that over the years, that I had transformed from being on fire for God to being on fire for me. Everything was about me. My vision, my church, my success, my reputation, my dream, my church, my services, my anointing, my, my, my, me, me ,me. It had become all about me, but how did this happen?
Everything in my life revolved around the prosperity of my vision and things that I wanted. I took out my note book and took a look at my confessions. They were all about me and my vision. Things that I wanted. It shocked me at how my relationship with God had become all about prosperity and what I could “believe” God for. My life had become full of faith formulas, confessions, mechanics and legalism.
As I studied, prayed and meditated, I could find nothing that I was doing wrong. I was just becoming a product of what I had been teaching for years. I had become humanistic. My view of God had become inward instead of God-ward. I began to re-examine my doctrines and word of faith teachings and realized that I had deceived myself into thinking that I was in control of my life and circumstances. I had taught and believed that I could control everything with my faith and confession. So I began to revisit these teachings and do a more in depth study. I started listening to ministers that I would have mocked a year before.
Over that year I believe that I have identified FIVE MAIN AREAS of erroneous teaching that are the very foundations of the word of faith movement. I would like to share those five with you now if you are interested. If not, then dont read any further. It is not my intention to destroy anyone’s faith. I just know and realize that there is some serious error in the word of faith teachings that I must address, partly because I taught this message for many years to thousands of people.
My name is John Edwards, and I was a Faith Preacher for ten years and one month. My wife and I attended and graduated from the premiere word of faith seminary in the world. During school I had the opportunity of working for some of the most famous names in the word of faith movement.
We both graduated from school and returned to the Birmingham area and started a charismatic word of faith church in our living room. We had four people at our first service and took up a $300 offering. Over the years, we moved our church to several locations before building our first building on 18 acres of land in Clay, Alabama. Our church had around 300 active members although less than a hundred would attend on any given Sunday. Over all we estimate that we had at least 2,000 members come and go over that ten year period if not more. Charismatic churches we found have extremely high turn over. It was my observation that we would often attract people that had been church members at just about every other charismatic church in town.
I never really liked pastoring because of the politics and constant drama that went on. I loved to teach, visit with people in the hospital, and do the actual work of the ministry, but I hated all the other stuff that goes with it. I stayed frustrated, depressed and I was always discouraged.
As a word of faith Christian, I did all the things that the word of faith teaches. I confessed the Word. I talked in line with the Word. I called things that be not as though they were. I had written out “My Vision” and confessed it out loud almost everyday, all fourteen pages of it. I prayed in tongues for hours. I read books and listened to hundreds, if not to thousands of Cd’s by the prominent word of faith teachers. I went to seminars, revivals, classes and to all sorts of healing meetings, increase meetings, Holy Ghost meetings, Holy laughter meetings and even to numerous early morning prayer meetings. It was a tradition at our church to meet at four in the morning to pray for two hours. For many years I prayed, believed and confessed miracles, signs and wonders for our ministry. But not much happened along those lines. In fact, I buried a lot of people over those years, including my daughter that died of a brain tumor at the age of fourteen. I was constantly perplexed that the message of faith and healing that I was preaching did not seem to work in the lives of the congregation. It seemed like we had all of the same experiences, trials and tribulations as the other church folks around town. I was for sure that there should be a clear distinction between the people of the Word and the denominational people. We had revelation knowledge of the Word. We had a leg up on the Body of Christ. We had the Holy Ghost, prayed in tongues and most of all we had the word of faith message that was full of God’s victory, prosperity and healing power. But there was really no difference between us and them. By them, I am referring to the Baptist, Methodist, Presbyterian, and Assembly of God churches that we as word of faith people thought were missing out. I mocked their teachings and beliefs for years. I learned it from my word of faith teachers and peers. I continued the tradition.
About a year and a half ago and good friend from Tulsa sent me a CD teaching on pride. I hated it. It really bothered me a lot and got me to thinking and praying which is sometimes a dangerous thing to do! I had ministry business to attend to in Indianapolis and in Michigan, so I must have listened to that Cd a dozen times. It convicted me of self. It convicted me of pride. It opened my eyes to some of my motives. More than anything, it revealed to me that I had an enormous ego that could never, ever be content.
I realized that over the years, that I had transformed from being on fire for God to being on fire for me. Everything was about me. My vision, my church, my success, my reputation, my dream, my church, my services, my anointing, my, my, my, me, me ,me. It had become all about me, but how did this happen?
Everything in my life revolved around the prosperity of my vision and things that I wanted. I took out my note book and took a look at my confessions. They were all about me and my vision. Things that I wanted. It shocked me at how my relationship with God had become all about prosperity and what I could “believe” God for. My life had become full of faith formulas, confessions, mechanics and legalism.
As I studied, prayed and meditated, I could find nothing that I was doing wrong. I was just becoming a product of what I had been teaching for years. I had become humanistic. My view of God had become inward instead of God-ward. I began to re-examine my doctrines and word of faith teachings and realized that I had deceived myself into thinking that I was in control of my life and circumstances. I had taught and believed that I could control everything with my faith and confession. So I began to revisit these teachings and do a more in depth study. I started listening to ministers that I would have mocked a year before.
This testimony is quite a large testimony and if you would like to read more by John Edwards
31 FACTS ABOUT THE WORD OF FAITH by John Edwards.
The following are a few facts about the dangerous and deceptive Word of Faith Movement which is sweeping the Body of Christ with it’s lies and faulty theology:1) The Word of Faith heresy is a hybrid religion that is a blend of New Age ideas and Charismatic excesses.
2) It was founded by a Baptist Preacher that was heavily influenced by the mind science teachers of his day including Mary Baker Eddy. He brought in many New Age and Mind Science teachings and blended them with scripture twisted out of context.
3) The Word of Faith Theology was further developed by a man that claimed at least eight visitations from Jesus Christ. In each of these visits this preacher was given extra revelation and extra biblical insight.
4) This preacher boasted for years that he walked in Divine health although he was being treated for heart disease with medication.
5) This preacher’s message was a blend of the Word of God and his visions. He often taught the Word of God in light of his visions.
6) This is very similar to the Prophet Joseph Smith that claimed extra revelation through visits from Jesus and God as he founded the Mormon church.
7) Most of the highest regarded Word of Faith teachers have not been to a legitimate seminary. Most of them were self taught from listening to tapes from other Word of Faith teachers.
8) The Word of Faith Movement is anchored on one passage of scripture that is found in Mark 11:23-24. In this passage Jesus used a common, everyday Jewish hyperbole to teach his inner circle Apostles to believe in the power of God. The Word of Faith preachers have distorted the Greek text and the meaning of this passage to build an entire religion that revolves around faith and words as a means to obtain health and wealth.
9) Although the Word of Faith leaders do extensive teaching on faith and healing, it does not bear fruit in their own lives. Many of them died of tumors, cancer and heart disease.
10) Although the Word of Faith teachers love to minister from the 91st Psalm about God’s prophetic protection of the Messiah, they themselves live in constant fear and have numerous body guards and ushers.
11) The Word of Faith Message is centered on the prosperity scriptures that were meant for Israel under the Old Covenant. They emphasis tithing and sowing seeds as a means to obtain wealth. The Word of Faith Movement is obsessed with wealth and materialism and the worship of money.
12) The Word of Faith leaders teach that Jesus was wealthy although the scripture is very clear that he was not.
13) The Word of Faith leaders place thousands of well meaning believers under extreme pressure and condemnation by telling them outlandish and half true testimonies.
14) The Word of Faith leaders do an enormous amount of teaching on submission to authority, walking in love, and staying away from being offended. This produces a fearful cult like atmosphere in their churches. It keeps people from expressing hurts and concerns. It makes people feel like they cannot leave their church for any reason.
15) Many of the prominent Word of Faith teachers live the lifestyles of the rich and famous and flaunt it as a testimony of God’s favor while the people that are sending in their money are regarded as nothing.
16) The Word of Faith ministers are dishonest with scripture, often completely distorting it to rhyme with their doctrines.
18) Word of Faith ministers love to boast and brag about their faith and what their faith has done for them.
19) That is because it is called the Word of FAITH. It is a religion that revolves around faith instead of a religion that has faith in God. They teach faith in faith and faith in words.
20) The Word of Faith leaders teach that we are little gods and that we can act and perform much as God can. This also is a distortion of scripture and another thing that the Word of Faith has in common with the Mormons.
21) Word of Faith theology rejects the blood of Jesus as the sufficient atonement for our sins.
22) Word of Faith theology teaches that Jesus did not use His Divinity while on the earth while the Bible teaches that He was fully God and in total control at every moment.
23) The Word of Faith Movement teaches that words spoken from a human have inherent and creative power of their own.
24) Word of Faith teaches that Jesus said that you will have what you say, which is not what He said.
25) The Word of Faith theology depends on the King James translation of Mark 11:23-24
26) The same passage is found also in Matthew 21, and is worded quite differently, causing all the faith formulas based on Mark 11:23-24 to be out of whack.
27) The Word of Faith is humanism. It puts man in charge and God in the backseat.
28) The Word of Faith Movement misrepresents the character of Job.
29) The Word of Faith takes numerous passages from the New Testament and completely butchers them to fit their doctrine.
30) The Word of Faith creates fear, bondage, and a distorted unbiblical viewpoint of God.
31) The Word of Faith emphasises success and prosperity while Jesus stressed suffering and humility.
I will think of hundreds of other things after I post this, but these 31 facts are indeed facts. The Word of Faith is a cult because it is led by people claiming special insight and revelation that is unorthodox. They also attempt to control their subjects with fear, manipulation and bullying.
The Word of Faith is the Doctrine of Devils. It is an evil message that kills people and wrecks lives.
Please do not be afraid to look at the evidence. I was too afraid to examine the evidence because I wanted things my way. The Word of Faith put me in charge of my own life, and I liked that. But when I got up the courage to begin to read and study, God opened my eyes with truth and freedom. I am no longer in the cult!
UC Ministries Blog 
Ex-Word of Faith Movement Testimony: Pastor John Edwards
I would like to respond to one critism which says Jesus was poor.
Jesus was not poor he came from wealthy family in heaven where there is no lack (read the book of revealation to see the kind of richness that is there).But when he came on earth it was like for a rich American coming to Africa to save Africans.He is like made poor by coming and being in Africa but not poor at all.
Jesus didn`t come from a poor family like most of us.His Father in heaven is so rich.The are roads of gold and houses of diamonds there read book of revealation for proof.To say Jesus was poor is a direct insult to God his father and all high value properties for which they are joint heirs in heaven.
Also how can Jesus be poor while everthing was created through him? (John 1:1-3)Can a creator be poor?
I love one preacher who was so poor who preached prosperity Gospel in Africa and one person asked him why do you preach prosperity gospel while you are so poor and sick most of the times? and he replied Jesus send me to preach good news about his word not about my poverty and sickness.If word of faith preachers preach about divine health and they are sick like a sick pigs it is not a proof that what they preach is wrong and can not work, they may be wrong themselves but not the word.
Also it should be noted that people needs to hear and believe the word of faith preached because faith comes by hearing the word it doesn`t come from seeing the lives of the word of faith preachers or even other preachers.Word of Faith has worked for me here in Africa.If it hasn`t worked to others it is none of my business each one gets according to his own faith I can`t be a spokesman of somebody`s else faith and I am not allowed by scriptures to judge anybody why it hasn`t worked.What I know it has worked and helped me full stop.
You know the generous grace of our Lord Jesus Christ. Though he was rich, yet for your sakes HE BECAME POOR, so that by his poverty he could make you rich.
2nd Corinthians 8:9
RIch in spiritual blessings and eternal life no where does it say rich as in millions of dollars. How much money do these Word of fakes have anyway? Is the money trickling down to the seed (money) sowers? Doubt it!
I agree with you, Andrew John. The word of faith has worked for me too. For years I had criticized the word of faith teaching not because I really knew it but because the pastors of my church spoke against it. But later I was exposed to the teaching and found in it nothing that contradicted the Bible. So I believed it. The word of God works in our life only when it is mixed with faith inside us. There have been many years in my Christian life when I saw almost no evidence of the power of God’s word in my life though I heard it every week and read it every day. The principles of believing and confessing the word are true to the Bible. God told Joshua that the word should not depart from his MOUTH but that he should meditate it day and night so that it would be well with him and he would have good success. I have seen abundant fruit of the word of faith teaching after I started walking in it and putting it to the taste. I am not a preacher but whenever I am in conversation with brothers and sisters, I boldly tell them to apply the promises of God by faith to their problems.
The word of faith thing is another of satins tricks. You can name but you can’t claim it You can blab it but you can’t grab it because it doesn’t work. The preachers are the only ones prospering and its off your money. It’s for young healthy people, the older less healthy people figure out pretty quick that it just doesn’t work at all.
Right on!!!!! These men( copeland Haggin Hallam dollar duplatis etc…) get transformed into the image of Adam…..
Wrong perspective….trying to compare spirit world Heaven with money.
Read 2 cor 8:9 Jesus was poor and has make us spiritually rich.
In 1 cor 4:11 Paul describe himself and the disciples of jesus as poor.
U claimed the word of faith has worked for you which i want u to know its a lie.Didnt kenneth hagin die out of a heart failure in 2003 when he was alive was he not wearing reading glasses ?
Its is my prayer that God will open yr eyes to know that the health and wealth gospel is simply demonic which E W Kenyon got from the occult group inAmerica called new age movement
The word of God has power! You are not to focus on your circumstances. I pray for you. It seems as though you are mad at God for what happened with your daughter. Please do not judge God and his word based on men. You sound like you did not have the word in you heart. Your prayer should have been for God to help your unbelief. I pray that the blood of Jesus covers you and your family. And the Lord comforts you and gives revelation for what you are seeking. We are all called to build up the kingdom of God unfortunately we now live in this physical world in this physical body and money is something useful. However, we are not to worship money or believe it’s our answer. I can’t judge you but it seems like you fell off track and you were seeking God with your mind and not surrendering your heart. Don’t judge God by men. I don’t know what a “Word of Faith Movement” is but the bible teaches that we are not to speak on things as they are but as they should be. As long as the earth remains seed time and harvest will not cease. If you want friends sow a seed of friendship. God works according to our faith and obedience. Just admit that you lost your faith in God’s ability. Focus on you eternity not this very tiny portion of life lived on earth. I believe you will see your precious daughter again! God Bless You Sir!
Have you ever researched the following;
– The Cry of the Huna / Genesis
(4,000-2,000 bce/ Enoch carbon dated fossils/ scrolls)
– The New World Testament
(book)
Mark Hanalei Mo’okini-Matias
“Mo’okini Heiau”
Pastor John Edward,
Your ego is ur nemesis,not the Word Faith movement.u have jump into errors.
Frankie: His ego WAS what kept him – and is keeping you – from seeing the truth about Word of Faith, which is inherently evil. He WAS in error.
Your right on! It was very difficult to face the real truth concerning the Word-Faith teachers being in denial of the truth of the gospel. They are so sold on this teaching because, really, I have tried speaking positive for sometime and it helps the mind, heart, and emotions to speak more positively about everything. But, poor ole Apostle Paul, many times he didn’t speak positive because he was so busy speaking the truth concerning his and others situations. He was “pressed on every side….” That wasn’t a good confession! The Word-Faith preachers would be very careful to correct Paul if he were living in our time. Or, would it go the other way? I would think that Paul would be most effective on these Word-Faith ministers and everyone else, as he was in his day. Because Paul’s faith was, is, and always will be strong in the Word! Too many of these Word-Faith ministers are into the Mormon teachings which are occult beliefs.
Thank you so much for speaking the truth in your writings and lectures.
The longer you continue speaking the truth, the more people will be exposed to it and eventually more will begin to accept what God’s Word is saying to His people!
We don’t have long to work. Let us work while it is still day. There will come a time when all of our works will cease and we will reap the works of our hands. I just want to do what God wants me to do because all of the glory goes to Him. He’s the one doing the works through me. He’s the one who receives ALL the GLORY.
Shalom my brother!
Rachel Rae
Dear Brother John:
Thank you so much for this excellent synopsis, not in bitterness or in a name-calling fashion, but in the love of God.
Very interesting. So sad that another minister has turned on the very words of life because of His own confusions. I am from the same Bible College and am a Missionary Pastor in France for the past 5.5 years. I have lived just as John has, teaching this same word of faith. But my experience is completely different. The people I have taught have experienced life changing results from this Word of Faith. They see miracles in their Health, miracles in their finances and in their relationships. But as in anything good for us, mankind has a tendency to lose proper focus and become entangled in religious activity, often times being distracted by doing the formula instead of being in fellowship with the originator of the Word we speak and believe.
Now you may say, how can I speak God’s word and lose contact with the God whose words they are. This is something that the human nature of man is great at. They do it in their marriages (husbands and wives just going through the motions), they do it in every aspect of their lives. This is because man loves a religious activity and basis for living. Even if it is the worlds system, they still do it religiously following their lives by a dogmatic religious mindset of behavior. This is the human weakness. We tend away from staying engaged and tend towards disconnection. We would often rather just do what we know to do out of a sense of self righteousness and dogmatic duty then out of love and desire to please the Father.
How can anyone argue that speaking God’s word does not please the Father? Of course it does but if done out of a sense of works or self realization, it becomes disconnected from the source. Just as in any seeming religious activity. Word of Faith people are subject to the same weaknesses. We do religious activity but out of formula and a works and even prideful motive. This doesn’t work for Baptists, Methodists, or Charismatics. John you seemed to have found the issues that lie at the heart of all religious activity. Doing it for the wrong reasons and disconnected from the Person of Jesus / the Holy Spirit.
I fight the same thing. Just confessing the Word out of a self effort mentality. We have to keep our human tendency towards religious duty out of our Christianity. It contaminates everything.
You made some really wild claims about what Word of Faith people believe. Here is one of your statements: The Word of Faith leaders do an enormous amount of teaching on submission to authority, walking in love, and staying away from being offended…..
What? these are exactly the issues that are destroying the lives of believers and the world. Rebellion, hate, offense, strife. These are the things destroying Churches because they come straight from Hell. I would hope as Pastors we would focus our messages on helping people be delivered from what ails them.
Here is another one: That is because it is called the Word of FAITH. It is a religion that revolves around faith instead of a religion that has faith in God. They teach faith in faith and faith in words……
This is not what we teach but a trap that anyone can fall into by separating God’s word and promises from a personal relationship with a loving heavenly Father. I have been in Word of Faith my entire life, and don’t agree with everything everyone says but neither do I think I am all knowing and have it all right either. We are all learning together.
I personally as a Pastor teach relationship with the Father first and foremost. Learning to relate to our heavenly Father correctly as the Good good father that He is. All other teachings stem from this and reinforce this one central theme of Christianity. John 3;16-17. God loves us so much. He came to restore the Garden relationship that was broken by sin. We cannot focus on formula but on the person of God the Father. Jesus came to reveal Him, and Him alone. Every alternate focus becomes religious activity if it is not foundationally and expressly done out of relationship with the Father.
IF you were to find fault with Word of faith believing and speaking, this is where it lies. In turning the celebration of relationship with the Father into anything else. This is how you keep religion from setting into the minds of believers. Not rejecting the truths of the Word of Faith movement. Everyone has issues in their lives that are not solved by a cut and dry formula. Poverty, many times is not even caused by giving or lack of giving. It is caused by people being poor inside minded. They are destined to live out a self image of themselves due to lack of having a renewed mind of who they are in Christ. So the issue is not how many scriptures can I confess on prosperity but in allowing the Word to do what it does by setting us free from our soulish chains that we carried into our Christian experience.
I will give you this. The Word of Faith as a whole in General has focused on financial Prosperity to an extreme. That does not make the truths we preach less true. It just makes for a mistake in over emphasis. Brother Hagin wrote a book on it called “The Midas Touch” where he called out all of his spiritual offspring on the extremes of the prosperity emphasis. Most did not listen or alter their messages accordingly. This does not change the truths found in the word of God. It just means that fallible men are still making mistakes. As you know, being a Preacher does not make you perfect and infallible.
I can only speak for myself. I teach everything from a relationship foundation. Not a formula foundation. In fact, I emphasize that if you just confess the Word as a religious formula, it will not work for you. Because God only releases His power when it is based in our relationship with Him. If Faith in Faith or faith in our confession worked then it cuts the person of the Father out of the picture. Anytime we do that, we will not see results. So this is why your people were not seeing results. Not because the truths of the Word of Faith teachings and scriptures are not true, but because you failed to teach it from a relationship paradigm. Remember the Garden is what Jesus returned us to. A simple relationship with the Father. Not based upon our confession but based upon His love for us. Speaking God’s word is the highest compliment you can give Him and activates His power in our lives just as if He said it Himself…which He actually did. But if it is done out of self seeking and self effort then it too becomes as powerless as the dead religion so many denominations lead their people in.
“21) Word of Faith theology rejects the blood of Jesus as the sufficient atonement for our sins.”
Hmmm – Was in Faith Movement for about 15+ years; 79′ Rhema grad, pastored, church, thousands of hours of teaching, etc….similar background to your. Never heard nor read #21. Not sure why you say that. Care to elaborate?
Anyway, I left too. Good for you to use your own mind again. There’s a reason we all have a mind. Please be careful not to be falling into a similar ditch of judgment and over-studying the Bible to prove yet another point.
Consider another leap of growth on your path:
Perhaps….Relax…let go….and ….perhaps let go …of the need to figure it all out…..and love.
Dear John
How is it brother that christians go to war against christians. You said on one of your videos how you were once part of the Faith movement and believed what they did. You then explained how you came to your senses and realised that you were not there to serve and love God but to serve and love self. John you now are on the internet warning others that the Faith message as taught by others (you called them the false teachers) is a lie. John my brother, and please forgive me if I refer to you as my brother, do you really expect others to believe you when by the testimony of your mouth you said you did not love God. Should anyone heed your words just because you now plead that you only believed that message because of ignorance. I suspect my brother that you are now trying to cover the fact that you were not right before God and are now justifying your wrong by pointing the blame on others instead of yourself. My brother the older I get ( not that I am old ) the more I realise how pathetic I really am and how wonderful God really is. Time does not permit me to go into detail, but if I were explain how much hurt and pain I experienced at the hands of other Christians, a book written would not be sufficient. How long I groaned before God and man, pointing to the false doctrine and lies of others. Years past, bitterness and anger grew to the point that I no longer focused on Him but only focused on the lies and hurt others caused me. If it wasn’t for the loving kindness and mersy of Jesus I do not know where I would be today. My brother I am only able to be in a place of love and forgiveness to the hurts of others because Jesus first pointed to my sins and how I also have hurt others. My brother have you found a place in your heart to let go and forgive. If you have not then you should not expect others to forgive you including God. You said that these Faith preachers proclaim that you can have whatever you say. If you say your head is killing you that is what you will receive. Need a car, call one into existence. Need some money command one to come. You said that words in the mouth of a believer have no power, only in the mouth of God do they contain power. My brother the problem with the world, Believer’s included, is that we do not really know the power of our words. My brother I am not talking about the metaphor Jesus used about speaking to mountains. My brother I am talking about how we go about killing each other with our words. More people in this world have been destroyed by words than any other evil tool devised by man. With the same tongue we praise God we curse our brother. How is it my brother that you justify a sin with another sin. In your video you said that God loves man and his sin. My brother that is a false doctrine. God loves man but hates sin. So much so that He Himself had to take it upon Himself to destroy it. My brother do we take the liberty that we have been given and join it to a harlot and expect God to turn a blind eye. No my brother if we are joined to a harlot we turn to God and ask Him to fill our lives with His loving kindness, to fill that place in which the harlot dwells. I can only hope my brother that you see this one thing. If the love of God were in you, your words would not point to the faults in others they would point to God Himself. My brother you are caught up in bickering and back bitting. So much so that you are trying to build a ministry on revealing the false prophets of this world. You do this as I said earlier because you are trying to distance yourself from those who you believe are false. There is a medical term for this. It states that people do this to bring credibility into their own lives. Tell me this my brother. All those who were saved by and are saved by the ministry of these so called false prophets saved or not? Are they going to Heaven or Hell? Does not the bible, which you so carefully placed on the table to be seen by your target audience, say that, wether in truth or false hood if Christ is preached so be it. If God’s love were to only extend to our perfection on being right all the time then we are all damed to hell. My brother, You are American are you not? Do you believe your constitution? Does it not say something about freedom of speech. Tell me my brother. Why accuse believers. Should you not stand against those within your own nation who would seek to stop you and all others from the freedom in which you so boldly speak. Do not those who rule over you oppress you. Do they not wish to take away your liberty and that of all. If you enjoy the liberty that you now have do not fight against those who do not speak evil of you. Look at the liberty in which you now proclaim boldly and remember this. The war which you now fight is a war that you will lose. Just as America has lost and will continue to lose wars that do not concern them, so will believers lose wars that do not concern them.
Your Brother in Christ’s service
Arthur Cricelli
acricell@gmail.com
Hello Arthur,
You said How is it Christians go to war with other Christians. They don’t! You assumed false teachers are Christians along with their sheep. However, Jesus made it clear that HIS SHEEP hear his voice and not the voice of a stranger, they will not follow a strange voice which equals strange doctrine, so this makes anyone following false teachings tares not real wheat. They may be in the process of being saved but until they follow truth they are not according to Jesus, so enough with your ramblings!
Arthur someday I hope you too will wake up and join the brothers and sisters who have found the truth in the word of God. That you would put on the armour of god and fight the good fight and when you do truly have the full truth that god will give you if you want you will feel the same way that we do. We love you Brother Arthur. My middle name is arthur.
We’ll said Arthur!
J Edwards ( not John Edwards)
I have had the pleasure of meeting John Edwards – a beautiful brother who has been disappointed and didn’t saw human flaws in Leaders. Prayerfully your words of love and encouragement may enlightened.
John,
Thanks for your awesome comments! I think they are completely true! I use to listen to the minister over the radio that you referred to in your commjents. Without mentioning names, he was my favorite minister. This went on for many years! I use to attend meetings where this person was very highly favored. But, I have been praying that God would keep me from deception and boy did He open up a lot of information concerning my favorite minister that I did not know he taught! I was floored with this and many other deceptions! Many ministries that I thought was real and people staying with the Word, were in fact – false. There are many, many other deceptions in government, education, banking, etc.
We have been duped in many areas of life. God knows how very much we need to stand with people who are truly seeking “truth.” Many who say they are seeking truth are not. They won’t listen when you try to inform them. Because if they accept the truth, responsibility comes with it to change associations, come out of apostasy churches, etc. They do not wish to disassociate from heretical teachings! It is sad. But, thanks for standing up for the truth. There WILL be those who take the information you provide and do more searching into the areas you mentioned. You can prove what you said by the books and other publications these ministers have out in circulation to the public. It’s worth the search to have our eyes open to what they are out there peddling. Hate to use the term, peddling, but that is exactly what it is. They are peddling their teachings for personal gain, or filthly liquor, just as the Word warns us.
Thanks again for writing this blog, it is a true eye-opener!
Most ministers are getting paid from churches that cannot afford to keep their buildings open, never mind maintaining a substantial monthly salary. The mega-churches can survive, but spare a thought for the people that love God with all their hearts and keep his commandments, but suffer at the hands of victimizing, manipulating, controlling bullies of the gospel. God does not want any of his children to perish, but some leaders have a lot to answer for – for the negative way in which God’s children see Him. Sadly, some of us see Him through the lives of these broken vessels (leaders) that have not yet come to repentance nor, a full heart knowledge of who He-Jehovah God truly is.
Wow…lots of responses. Let’s get to the root of the problem. These Faith preachers create a one man false gospel. They tend to dominate the office of preacher, teacher and prophet….this is very dangerous. An unjust balance is then created and this an abomination to the Lord…proverbs 11
I am a guy who got a heavy prophetic gift placed on me at age 28…it was amazing back then. I know the evil spirit that lurks in the positive confession movement. The spirit said…if I bless you…will you give 1 million dollars to Jesse Duplantis….I eventually agreed. I have been blessed but I do not have a million dollars to give to anyone.
Three years later I heard the same voice….I desire the daughter of walter hallam….I thought…which one…..I knew it was the middle child.
3 months later this daughter died in a plane crash with 2 others.
Positive confession faith is under the law….therefore cursed! Look at the tragedy of oral robers….understand that yes…you can get prosperity through these prosperity demons….but their price always has to be paid.
I prefer the price paid by Jesus.
Always a problem when there is Jesus AND some one….Jesus and mohamed…Jesus and Smith….Jesus and Kenyan. In this case….AND is an abomination to the Lord
Hi Rachel, I couldn’t have said it better myself! After being thoroughly indoctrinated in Word of faith, I often wondered why did Jesus make a “bad” confession over Jerusalem when he came into the city that last time and prophesied judgment over them. And why he said “the poor you will always have with you.” More to the point, I wondered why our faith pastors never pointed out these and other “bad” confessions made by Jesus or his disciples, or the prophets. Those statements contradicted their teaching. On the surface, it seems benign to be a positive confessor, however it is anything but. It’s a gross misinterpretation of scripture according to the wickedness of the human heart. It pushes God to the side and puts faith on the throne.
Talk about ‘killing him with your love’, brother!? The man is confessing his past false religion and you judge him?
Hi Leonard, totally agree with you. I believe that Arthur Cricelli doesn’t even see that WOF itself is defective, judging by his comment. But it is. WOF is what leads man to serve himself while fooling him into thinking he actually serves God. I still know people caught up in this cult 30 years later. Sadly they still haven’t figured it out yet.
i believe him , I am also a former teacher of Hagin’s Essek William Kenyon teaching, Christ freed m mind from it, it is a deadly trap and a self serving snare , which holds you psychologically till they lead you to a inclusive one world religion mixed in with the Vatican made to believe that the anti Christ is the ministry and servants of Christ.
From UC Ministries : This site does not belong to John Edwards. I have posted his testimony as it was relative to the Word of Faith heresy. I also reposted your posting to the relavent post rather than “THE CALLING”. Which I use for a seperate purpose. However their is a connection to Edwards own web site half way down the post. if you want to contact him personnaly.
Perhaps, then, it would be worth editing it so that it makes sense and is not copied twice, which breaks the point of reposting up significantly. Also, I stopped reading when your bright red font gave me a headache. I figure because you’re happy pointing out some flaws publicly, you will be excited to receive this message of a few minor ones of your own.
I agree with Arthur Cricelli. I have been to many Word churches (seldom called Word of Faith any more) and they teach to make MUCH of the precious blood of Jesus!! And they don’t quote only from the KJV. Most, or many of the teachers use the amplified Bible.
And while there will always be false ministers who misuse their position–and I have seen this, in fact cannot watch them on tv or internet–there are MORE that teach prosperity is not just ‘money’ but good health, a good relationship with God, the freedom in the USA to freely have and read Bibles, and to contribute not to man but to God, of which much of what is contributed is used to help missionaries who serve in some of the worst conditions in sometimes dangerous other countries. They teach LOVE, and that Jesus was always moved with compassion when He prayed for people. Yes, the words we speak DO influence and shape our lives. But we’re taught to study the words of JESUS, and when we pray for others to pray to the Father in Jesus name, and only that God’s will be done.
I go to a Word church that is not a mega-church, and we’re like family. There’s so much love, no gossip, backbiting or cliques. People help each other! Our pastor is not remote and in an ivory tower apart from the people, but like Shepherds live with their sheep, he is ‘real’ down to earth, not a walking ‘suit’ who disappears after the serman, but mingles with and loves the sheep.
In Heaven there will be no denominations or walls separating ‘different groups’ from each other. I’m looking forward to that day. So tired of reading disgruntled ex sheep dissing on the basis of not knowing all the facts, or experiences of one or two churches. Pray for them instead!! With discernment, we can spot false teachers; they are in ‘every’ movement, not just Word ministries. And when God tells us it’s time to leave, we are to leave in ‘love’ and pray for the false teachers to get right with God. God doesn’t desire ANYone to go to hell!! You can better serve God by PRAYING for the people you disagree with. And I”m praying for YOU.
Tyla I to went to a small word of faith church. Im sure your pastor does love you. But if you do your homework and invest part of your time what it truly stands for you might change your oppinion. We were there for 16yrs and yes god finally gave us our walking papers. It may be a loving church like you say but if it spouses any of the tennets that the word of faith belives in it may be the best place to run from but the holy spirit has to reveal it to you. I cant. You sound like your heart is in the right place but becarefull theses are the last of the last days and satan is seeking whom he may devour.
I have met some wonderful Word of Faith Pastors with real power and love of God.I have also met some really evil once who are controlling freaks and possibly witches who went to Rhema.I know many families who are suffering for leaving Charles Boakye’s church because he said he would sort them out.Some are divorced,some are sick,some are unemployed.When things go wrong in people’s lives he pretends he doesnt know yet behind their back he will tell some leaders & other church members what the real cause is ‘so that you can learn’.He claims they sinned and he has decided not to forgive them and they will suffer until they become holy.Many spent long periods slumbed up in bed sick or unemployed until he decides to free them.His justification he claims is John 20:22,23.
Charles Boakye is a number one witch and is very unrepentant. What is even worse is he wants to have a Rhema Bible School in his church when he’s involved in witchcraft. He openly says he delivers anyone he wants to Satan and does that every time to make people suffer and teach them lessons.What I do not understand is how Rhema endorses him when he mixes the word with witchcraft.
I feel pity for anyone who walks into that cult their lives will be messed up by the time they leave.
That is a spirit of witchcraft. It must be destroyed by the word and the blood of Jesus. Our minds are such that we believe what man says sometimes, because we have been brain-washed. We have been so intricately created by God that we must be careful to not allow suggestions from men to rule and destroy our lives. We must hold onto and believe every word that Jesus spoke towards us before he was resurrected. For those who have taken on ailments from manipulating soul destroying men and women; whose report are you going to believe. God gave us a spirit of love and a sound mind. Release fear from your lives and live the way that God would want you to. Don’t let His Son’s dying be in vane.
The entire Word of Faith doctrine seems to call into question God’s sovereignty as well as over looking the fact (which Paul speaks at length about in Romans 8) that although believers have been saved, based on our faith in Christ, we still struggle with personal sin on a daily basis. However, because we have been called we are no longer slaves to our sinful nature, although it may at times rear its ugly head in our lives. How are naturally sinful people supposed to know what to speak into existence? To assume that we are somehow on the same level with the absolute sovereignty of the Lord and have dominion over him is almost blasphemous to me. I did not grow up in the church and was saved by God’s grace through faith in my college years. Since then I have searched the scriptures for evidence of the Word of Faith’s doctrinal teachings and despite taking 1-2 verses out of context and ignoring the larger gospel message I do not see the so called “name it and claim it” teachings to have any foundation in the Holy Word of God. I also have numerous family members who have fallen into the Word of Faith movement and have reaped absolutely nothing but sin and lack of fruit in their lives in both the material sense which this movement holds so dear, and the spiritual sense. I applaud Edwards boldness in calling out false teachers, as the Bible tells us to do, it is time that this doctrine is revealed for what it truly is so that the true believers in scripture will no longer be mislead by wolves in sheep’s clothing.
I think that it is important to read the bible for yourself and before reading it ask God to help you to understand it.I agree with some of the things the Edwards stated. Most churches just beg and make the members feel guilty if they do not give according to what they think is approprieate.Churches are run like bussiness.Chruch goers are more intereasted in the blessings from God instead of living to praise God.I watched a man named Master Phrophet Bernard he opened up the broadcast asking for a seed offereing and then he talks about how he can tell you what God will do for you ,while blessing a child he called it a he and it was a girl.It is just all so stupidand people are so desperate for a change and poor people send there money it is all just so discussting.Hickey ministries -the same scam,Paula white constantly lying,eddie long and the list goes on and on.Members are taught they can not say anything or your speaking against God.Church has become a Joke a way for people to make money-read your bible associate with ggod like mined people and yes you can do that with out attending a church
God Bless Everyone and May You all Find and Worship the True God!!!!
It is sad, but whether it be word of faith, reformed, baptist, and on and on ad infinitum. The truth is there is only one truth, one gospel. The test is in 1 John 3:9-10 who really is a child of God or a child of the devil. I have not spoken to one so called Christian minister who passes the test. There is none who understand, and it is all about understanding. Read the book of proverbs. We have had a Christianity who has denied Christ and trampled him underfoot. The so called Christian church is the harlot of Revelation. She has been unfaithful to Christ and his gospel.
The gospel in its simplicity has been missed entirely by the church.The church believing that SIN is still here and all it does it plow it up. The church has trusted in the LAW, and not Christ. Read ROMANS 4:15 WHERE THERE IS NO LAW, THERE IS NO TRANSGRESSION. IS NOT THIS PLAIN? Not to the harlot church, she denies what Christ did on the cross and says there is still sin. The world is in chaos and misery because of the church and her unfaithfulness.
@joseph. I agree the need to trust in Christ alone. In fact teaching the law has produce a Romans 7 man rather then Romans 6 which I our understanding of being co- crucified that our old man would be buried with him 6:6. I encourage you though brother that tho all have turned astray (Romans 3) yet it is Christ who holds us and freely justifies us. That Christ is the one who did not turn astray on our behalf that His faith can be our faith. There are teachers that hav encouraged me on this but luckily like 1 John the anointing does teach us all things. praise God. There’s great grace preachers too such as Rob Rufus (check him out at city church on google) an many others. I’m praying about moving to a community which believes in His grace alone as our justification (an sanctification 1 cor 3). I think if anything what the word of faith movement has switched from is from Gods word to ours. Ew Kenyon (who started the word of faith movement) as far as I know had an understanding that in Christ we are new creations. Now when Gods work is not fully understand we will then take the place of what he has accomplished. But we know from the book of Hebrews that god HAS spoke in these days in His son and said It is Finnished. This includes the devil (heb 2:14 ) sickness (Isaiah 53/ rom 8 (his spirit will give life to our mortal bodies as well), relationships (he has made the two one tearing down the dividing wall of hostility – which is the law) and sin both the guilt shame etc. but also the entity (he who knew no sin became sin for us so that we might become the rughteousnes of God) I know at first glance it may seem arrogant to say we can heal or cause things to come but in understanding it is purchased by Christs blood like Paul said if we boast le us boast in Christ. Now my mind is being renewed In the truth of all Christ has done but if we encourage each other in the faith (rather than the law) I believe holy Spirit will produce more Christ likeness in us than trying to keep Barriers on (it’s for freedom sake Christ set us free). Lets first get the revelation of gal 2:20 then the exterior stuff will have more of a grace approach rather than law
Brother Joe you cant paint the church of god with a broad brush because there are still churchs to day that is preaching the true gospel.There is still a good number of churches who beleive in the gospel. Dont go on a witch hunt but if you find someone who is in false church you will do justice to pray for them.
k
well when the end times hits all things that can be shaken will be…its about knowing God. the main point that people miss and Hagin did not realize was it was not about his claiming things, it is about biblical meditation…Joshua 1:8 and Romans 12:2 renewing the mind to know what Gods will is….knowing Gods will and walking in the fruit of the spirit. so the WOF people missed it by trying to speak and not having it get down in the heart to change ones perception. Like the saying ” Its all in your mind” as a man/woman thinks so is he/she…a person who has their mind renewed according to the word of God can then be led by the Spirit of God into the plan that God has for him or her. now thats real prosperity! prospering is to know God and to do his will and being content on where one is in life!
Well when the end times hits all things that can be shaken will be…its about knowing God. the main point that people miss and Hagin did not realize was it was not about his claiming things, it is about biblical meditation…Joshua 1:8 and Romans 12:2 renewing the mind to know what Gods will is….knowing Gods will and walking in the fruit of the spirit. so the WOF people missed it by trying to speak and not having it get down in the heart to change ones perception. Like the saying ” Its all in your mind” as a man/woman thinks so is he/she…a person who has their mind renewed according to the word of God can then be led by the Spirit of God into the plan that God has for him or her. now that’s real prosperity! prospering is to know God and to do his will and being content on where one is in life!
ALL THESE DEBATED MEAN NOTHING TO THE BLIND MAN THAT GET HEAL IN JESUS TIME, BECAUSE ALL HE KNOW WAS, THAT HE WAS BLIND, AND NOW HE SEE.JOHN 9:25. I KNOW GOD IS A HEALER HE HEAL ME WENT I WAS SICK. MY DAUGHTER WAS DYING IN THE NEIGHBOR HAND WHEN SHE WAS LESS THEN TWO MONTH OLD. I PUT SOME OLIVE OIL IN MY HAND,TAKE HER FROM THE NEIGHBOR HAND LAID MY HAND ON HER FOREHEAD CALL UPON THE NAME OF JESUS,,,AND SHE LIVE. WHAT ABOUT ME.ONE MINUTE I WAS ON CRUTCHES NEXT MINUTE I WAS DANCING.PRAISE GOD. I CAN GO ON, AND ON ABOUT MIRACLE GOD HAS DONE IN MY LIFE. ALL I KNOW HE IS NOT A MAN THAT HE SHOULD LIE,.WE HAVE TO TRUST HIM, WE HAVE TO BELIEVED HIM. WE HAVE TO KNOW, THAT WE KNOW THAT HE SAID AND HE WILL BRING IT TO PAST, HUMILITY IS NEED TOO, WHAT THOSE THE BIBLE: IF MY PEOPLE WHICH ARE CALLED BY MY NAME, SHALL HUMBLE THEMSELVES, AND PRAY AND SEEK MY FACE, AND TURN FROM THEIR WICKED WAYS; THEM WILL I HEAR FROM HEAVEN AND WILL FORGIVE THEIR SIN, AND WILL HEAL THE LAND. 2 CHR.7:14. THE KEY WORD IS HUMBLE, GOD CAN WORK WERE HUMILITY IS:PHIL 2.
Pastor John Edwards confessed that it is his ego and pride were the source of trouble.Then he related his experienced which he found got himself stuck in a rug.All our claiming and confessing of God’s words,or line up with God’s words through our mouth will not do anythin good because our Sins must be cleansed,first of all.The Lord will not hear us if we regard iniquity in our heart,..The doctrines of the Word movement,as a whole were very sound,except the part of mandatory Tithings,and curses for those who never or don’t pay tithes,that is troubling.I don’t expect Charismatic denomination to be perfect,but their works and fruits,love and zeal for the Lord’s Kingdom,we cannot gain-say.
No one could Biblically out-wit the prosperity messages,it is scriptural.For Christian to lay claim,or claim blessings from God,that is actually a kind of Good Fight of Faith.Unless you dispute God is the source of all blessings,and He desires to bless,or prosper His children as unsound doctrines,then you have a case to oppose Word Faith movement,otherwise you sit with those Accusers of our Brethren,the Office of Satan,well known for being The accuser of our Brethren,as John the apostle told us.If you are from a different ministries,to be not tempted by Jealousies and self-righteousness,and Judgmental attitudes,then Satan is too lazy,and does not hinder God’s move in Word Faith Movements.
Rival competitors,competing for the piece of morsel meat,betrayals and false accusation will be rampant—which part of human history we are not learning?Which Phraisee,seeing the crowd follows Jesus,can they be not tempted by Envies and Jealousies?Is human carnal flesh incapable of such wicked,malice and slanderous attributes?Despite the fact that many so-called Discerning ministries,Watchman’s ministries,who were motivated by Strife,hatredJealousies,but they do reasoned and slandered and distorted the Faith movements’ practice,doctrines ,the Charismatic movements—with very logical deductions.While proposing good doctrines and in the pretext of warning others not to be deceived by false prophets–yet they themselves are actual deceivers,provoking others,luring others to be judgmental,to be slanderer,to be another mouth piece of mis-information,mis-represention,thus good christians became twice the child of Hell.
How then can Christians not lose their Salvation,as they are being deceived by angels of light,they began to judge,criticised and hindered God’s movement,where Word Faith movement had the potentials of saving of millions of Souls?Opposing christian ministries is not the same as opposing Political Parties.LORD JESUS warned and threatened those who lost their First Love to repent,and those who are Lukewarm to repent,how much more on those who speak ill against His works,and against His servants?Not everyone who calls Me Lord Lord will be saved.But why?Miracles?Healings?Is there anything wrong to perform those signs of God?Of course not…Lord Jesus said,the Truth…whoever you are…IT IS YOUR INIQUITIES THAT PROMPT ME TO DISOWN YOU….your slander sin,fornication,your false accusations,your bearing of false witness against My servants…your opposition to my Ministries…your distortion and lies..your Envies..your Jealousies……SINS SEPARATE YOU FROM GOD,HAVE YE NOT HEARD?
Frankie there you go again twisting someones testimony. How pathetic you have become. I wonder when you will be allowed to quite posting on this website? The other day I was listening to Glora Copland and she said that Kenneth has the athority that he can say the word and stop a twister and it died out imediatley. Where was he when new orleans was being torn apart from that hurricane. The trouble is that the word of faith has no signs following it. You are taught to summit to authority but why do you cut John edwards to the quik. He is a awsome individual and If you had to go through just half of what he has you would be squeeling like pig. Leave him alone and all the truth ministers alone because someday your words will come back to roust. Victory in Jesus!
[…] – Pseudo-Pentecostalism; Article 2 – F.F. Bosworth’s Rejection of Initial EvidenceWHY I LEFT THE WORD OF FAITH AND RHEMA by John Edwards .recentcomments a{display:inline !important;padding:0 !important;margin:0 […]
I too was part of the word of faith and it was the worst time of my Christian life. I lost several church members and family members due to a well known minister that said many, many times that if you are still taking medication, you have no faith. Well, people have lost their lives thinking that the Lord did not heal them because they did something wrong or were not strong in the faith. I am now finally learning the truth about the Lord and it is not about us on this earth. Earth is NOT our final home and we can’t afford to get so caught up in material things. I pray before the Lord comes back that we will all return to our first love, Jesus, not prosperity.
family members due to a well known minister that said many, many times that if you are still taking medication, you have no faith…..Reply: People who are trusting God not only died perhaps on sicknesses,but also being fed to the lions!I have more respect for people trusting and placing faith in God,then died then those who doubt and had unbelief and murmur like you-complaint like the Israelites in the days of Moses.!People like you never read past the 5 books of Moses!People who murmurs and made complaints like your type were known as the Evils against God’s power and love….You may as well agree with those rebellious Istraelites..,Moses… you lead us out here to die in the desert!
The position on Medication and Faith in God were clearly drawn and well understood.If you are ignorant,so be it.Such unfair and evil attacks,and from your words,who would not hate those good Christians who encoiurage others to have Faith in God,and just like Jesus who rebuke his disciples of little Faith?…If we really believe God will come and pick us up when we die and as we plunge into eternity,can we not believe Him for healings in our bodies?….No doubt there are people like Peter who sank after walking on water for a while,don’t we applaud those who take the step of Faith?….You know that without Faith one cannot please God,and you contradict God’s Words here,base on human reasonings!
Frankie god gave us doctors and your talking like a christian science member. Frankie when you get a headache do you confess it away or do you take a aspirn. That has nothing to do with faith. When peter was walking on the water even though Christ had to rescue him it took more faith than you or I will ever have. Your kind of faith is not faith its stupidity. There are alot of documented cases where hundred of cult members have died including children because they refused medical care. Frankie dont you think they should have received medical care. God has healed me at times and I praise god for it. Paul told timothy take alittle wine for thy stomacks sake. What about that.
Frankie, you are using hatred and dissension rather than quoting scripture. Please back up your beliefs with scripture! our Lord and Savior wants unity between us and not create chaos. For example, please advise where does scripture say that Jesus will appear to anyone prior to his second coming as Kenneth Hagin stated he was visited 8 times?
Hello Arthur,
You said How is it Christians go to war with other Christians. They don’t! You assumed false teachers are Christians along with their sheep. However, Jesus made it clear that HIS SHEEP hear his voice and not the voice of a stranger, they will not follow a strange voice which equals strange doctrine, so this makes anyone following false teachings tares not real wheat. They may be in the process of being saved but until they follow truth they are not according to Jesus, so enough with your ramblings!
Pew Research did a survey on bible knowledge and religion and Christians scored below atheist. As long as there are spoon-fed bible illiterates you will have cults and people following false teaches. Once Christians read the whole bible cover to cover from Genesis to Revelation they will know the truth and the truth will set them free.
It is pathetic when atheist know more than Christians about our bible!
I believe that one finds “what one is looking for”.
I embraced several distorted teachings from some “Faith” preachers because i wanted the things of this world and found several “formulas” to get them.
All of you trying to Urgue up here are all eronous, one thing you forget to understand is that the Bible is so rich in both human and Godly wisdom, That is why I hear so many politicians quote God’s word in their selfish attempt to win people’s mind to vote for them and also several times I have heard judges use God’s word to pass their judgemts to their victims.This makes me to think that if you want to speak lies using God’s word for your own selfish interest you will, if you want to speak the truth by God’s word to bring all the glory to God, you will and if you want to remain confussed after studying same word you will. Up to this point, I can varify boundly that all you who have urgued up here don’t understand the mind of Jesus Christ yet, how would Jesus Christ answer all these fightings about who is Mr. Right and who is Mr. Wrong in all these bubblings and urguements of who is right and who is wrong, lets see from Jesus’ mouth Himself,”
MATTHEW 13: 24
The Parable of the Weeds
24Jesus told them another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. 25But while everyone was sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away. 26When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared.
27“The owner’s servants came to him and said, ‘Sir, didn’t you sow good seed in your field? Where then did the weeds come from?’
28“‘An enemy did this,’ he replied.
“The servants asked him, ‘Do you want us to go and pull them up?’
29“‘No,’ he answered, ‘because while you are pulling the weeds, you may root up the wheat with them. 30Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.’”
Now, friends, if Jesus could answer that way, who are you trying to judge this and that, who knows they are doing wrong? Anything that is not of God will never stand. And that is the Bottom line! Apostle Jonas.
.All of you trying to Urgue up here are all eronous,……Reply: Most of the people here just don’t get it but just fell into deceptions,one by one.UC ministries here is just purposely attacking and hindering the Words of Faith movements by making accusations and evil speakings.In so doing,acting like wolves,tearing the sheep of God,devour them,mislead others to the baits,and they will also like them be another foul mouth,be another false witnesses,so that all will be condemned-just like Korah and his company….Acts said..leave them alone,lest you are fighting against God!
Even the persecutors of those days understand something but our people today just act blur,not knowing that an attack on one Christian is an attack on all of us.And it is also an attack of the Kingdom of our Lord Jesus Christ.There are ignorant fools,killing others and thought they are serving God!…Satan had an office,as the prosecutor,as the false witness against our brethren,work as an accuser before God, against us,and our brethren.Satan must have good grounds to accuse us before God 24/7 right?…Why so many of you join forces with him to accuse our brethren?
Let us just be honest and stop guessing!If the Lord’s work among His servants were sucessful,and they had growth and revivals,so for people like us who are jealous of them,we who dislike and hate our brethren in our hearts,out of rivaries and hate,shouldn’t we attack them?Shouldn’t we slander them?
Tell me,since when Sibblings Rivalries,Cain Killed Abel,that wicked Demons working,had taken his holidays?Just Look at Joel Osteen sucess.Only an idiot cannot see those attackers were inspired from the darkside!
We all love David Wilkerson.He criticised them.He died in a car crash.He was taken out of the way!He died in the hometown of Joel Osteen!Now which part we dont ‘understand?
Joel Osteen called people to come to Jesus for salvation.Some people hated him.He gave altar called.Some people dislike it.He preached that we have found favor with God,and we have a clean mouth.John Macarthur preaches that we should have a foul mouth like Isaiah,and our righteousness should be like filthy rags,that we should be found out of favor with God.
Can you beleve it?People actually agree with John Mac,hoping and praying we all have unclean mouths and foul mouths and we continue to be like filthy rags!
Why disapproved of Joel Osteen teachings that we have found favor with God through our Lord Jesus Christ?
I noticed those who go around thinking that they are warning us against false prophets and teachers,the truths are,they are deceivers themselves.They hurt our Saviour daily by their evil speakings.They lure others to bear false witness against our good brother,and good ministers of the Lord,like Benny Hinn.
These stupid fools are hoping that Fires will proceed out of the mouths of the prophets to consume them,and hastening the coming of the two last days witnesses!
If you dare to bear false witnesses again and claimed that the Word of Faith and the Charismatics movement are false,you set yourself apart,and you draw a line,like Korah and his company against Moses then.Jesus warned,no false witnesses will enter God’s Kingdom.
Don’t be a fool,and become another recruits for the Obnoxious nuts who blame Word of Faith movements here,spewing their bitterness and animosities here.If you cannot see their evil speakings and words of divisions,surely you are baited already!
Jonas do you have children? If you do would let them play in the street or would you walk over and pull them by the arm and save them from possible harm or even death. God expects us not to bury our head in the sand but to stand proud as a warrior with our armour on and to with stand the firey darts of the devil Jesus loves us so much that on the cross his
The following are a few facts about the dangerous and deceptive Word of Faith Movement which is sweeping the Body of Christ with it’s lies and faulty theology:1) The Word of Faith heresy is a hybrid religion that is a blend of New Age ideas and Charismatic excesses.
Reply: Satan is well established as the accuser of our brethren.Did he divides our Christendom,cause suspicion,cast discords,and present a well logical case before our God,every day?Millions of of copies of accusations against our Christian Ministries,never would you heard the fact that Satan is an accuser,but is awell known face among true believers.
Is the Word Faith movement,the Charismatics denomination who were in errors or those accusers were the ones in actual errors?Look at the exaggerated and make-up lies about the link that Word of Faith had in common with New Age and Eddy Baker.These false accusers have no shame,but stick to their deceits,and will stop at nothing but continue to bear witnesses,as they hope also to mislead others,and they too should bear false witness,thus all would be condemned and had their names erase from the Lamb Book of Life.
If someone want you to bear false witnesses,please refrain,why should you lost your own standings with God just because of some true pictures you were not thoroughly informed?We understand that most people would jump into conclusion and cast a verdict,judge against Christian ministries,and condemned them,not realising they actually hurt themselves because they are not privy to the full facts.
If someone want to you to be another foul mouths against someone else,to sklander,why be witness for them?You are to witness for the Lord Jesus and never for some accusations against another brother or sisters in Christ!
If someone wants to recruit you,stir up your angst against another brethren,why fall into the baits?The Word of Faith Movement ALWAYS SPEAK FROM The PLATFORM OF TRUTHS AND RIGHTEOUSNESS.
Let’s face it.There will be injustice,wrongs and faults which could be found in all denominations.Anyone,can act like an agent of Satan,criticised any servants of God,and wash their dirty laundries,attack their mistakes,and tommorow you will find no one serving the Lord in any work anymore!The entire Christendom will halt and no Gospel will be preach anymore!Tell me honestly,whose agendas was it to see the lost souls stay lost?
The Word of Fath teachings major doctrines are well established and understood.It is Lord Jesus who saves,heals and bless.As a whole,we knew for sure what they stand for.Many milions of souls were saved,enter God’s Kingdom,how can we be so blind so as not to recognise their well meaning efforts?Who do you think were their enemies?
Notable man in Word of Faith movement were,late Kenneth E Haggin,Benny Hinn,TB Joshua,ReinHard Bonke.And we were all agreeable with the Evangelical Christians,Billy Graham,Campus Crusade for Christ,Anglican,Methodists…It is an open facts and truths that everyone knows Charismatic statements of Faith,and it is perfect sound doctrines which is scriptural and Biblical.
Of all the attacks those wicked accusers spread in our world,they dare not touch the doctrinal Faiths,or disagree with us.Except the Jehovah’s Witness,Mormons,Oneness Pentecostal,we never share their beliefs.
The attackers fear the Charismatic Christians because we have the spiritual gifts;and all your secrets would be exposed,and we can discern whether or not you have demons or not.Coming to our presence,you yourself will manisfest the Demonic activities.All your lies will be exposed.This is the reason that we are growing at such a fast rate,and have you heard of the 54 millions decision for Christ in Africa,led by Reinhard Bonke?Reinhard Bonke is our Word of Faith preacher,help also cmae by Kenneth Copeland ministries,of whom many people like to hate and attack.Imagine,you wanted to hinder millions coming for the Lord Jesus,are you not another Hitler,and another mass murderers worst than atheist Mao Tse Tung?Your evil hands which wrote hatred and slander,and wrote offensive words against my Lord Jesus workers,trying to stop God’s hands on all of us,no hell could be deeper for you,is it not?
You thought you are trying to expose and warn others on Faith Movements,but God’s testify to you that it is you who are deceived and you sinned greatly,but you refused to listen and hear!Who were the false prophets and false teachers of our days?Are they not your type of people?Your wicked judgmental attitudes against your fellow brethren?You pretend to warn others of deception,but your own bitterness and strife have been all the while most evident in our sight!
The spirit of jealousies and envies were so clear.Spreading animosities,and hating your brethren,don’t you know you abide in death all the while?
Jesus warn that not all who call Me Lord Lord shall be saved.No false witnesses,no slanderers, shall enter God’s Kingdom.
UC ministries were not of God.
Recently I left a word of faith church after 16 years.
The pastor was so dogmatic on what he believed that even though part of what he believed was good there was so much false docrine that it choked the truth that he preached. Pastor, to belive that Jesus was only a man makes him a counterfiet according to scripture. HE WAS AND IS THE SON OF GOD AND ALSO IS A MAN.
To say he went to hell to the region of the damn to attone for our sins is blasephany
He shed his blood on calvary and if I accept anything else Im discounting his sacrifice. To say He was born again in hell is completely false. He bore our sins on the cross but did not sin him self. He did not need to be born again because unlike the word of faith pastors ,his nature was not satan but was of the father divine nature and human. When he said It is finished can you imagine wakeing up in hell the god that created the universe and spending Three days in hell God will not share his deity with anyone including Keneth hagin which was deflocked from the assembly of God kenneth copeland or any of the so called prosperity theachers. A little bit of leaven spoils the hole lump how about alot of leaven
The BIBLE SAYS THAT GOD WILL VOMIT YOU OUT OF HIS MOUTH IF YOU ARE LUKE WARM. Read jude and see what the word of god says about all of this.Finally we are being bombarded every day with the occult in our movies, internet,written word, and so on. We are to earnestly contend for the faith that was once delivered to the apostles. Why did I stay soT long in a word of faith church? Because the pastor was my friend and I loved him.
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Pastor, to belive that Jesus was only a man makes him a counterfiet according to scripture….REPLY: Please save your deceits and slanders.The Faith Movements are part of the Evangelical Christendom.You knew next to nothing of our creed,our Faith and our belief?
Which Christian did not know that to assert or believe that Jesus was only a man,that is wrong,error and incomplete?Are you not meaning us as a fool to not know that anyone,to say that Jesus was only a man is a false teacher?
Some Crazy slanderers misquote the infamous Slanders.It is a twisted context of what Kenneth Copeland preach.Save your deceits.
Graduates from Word Faith movements were by the millions,and you have the audacities to use some misunderstand of yours to attack our brethren,and to recruits more people to bear false witness?
You said:
He did not need to be born again because unlike the word of faith pastors ,his nature was not satan but was of the father divine nature and human.
Reply: Now all Faith movements and everyone us agree with your statements,100%,so from now on will you recant and repent of your follies?Since when did we not believe the same Doctrines like yours,and affirm that Jesus nature is not Satan?
The local word of faith church here has lots of females in it, I all them Eves, they name it but can’t claim it, they blab it but can’t grab it because it doesn’t work, but the preacher is prospering, when anyone in his family gets sick or cancer they have to hide, sneak out of town for treatment and pretend it works and he is hot tempered and abusive, his poor wife.
Bearing false witnesses and telling others that we are in heresies,and Word Faith movements had heresies,and that we did not agree with Evangelical doctrines.What kind of deceits,and have I not seen them for many decades by now?
By making tales and lies and distort what we preach,that is slander and evil.Did not Jesus said,Depart from Me,you workers of Iniquities…Iniquities= deceits,lies,distortions,envies,and strifes sown aming brethren….I WILL SPEW YOU OUT OF MY MOUTH……
HAVE YOU NOT READ,HE THAT LOVE NOT HIS BRETHREN ABIDE IN DEATH?
Who says we are bearing false witness against anyone. Your bearing false witness upon false witness and magnefying it. When you look through a binoculars which end do you look through. Enough said.
Mr. Edwards,
I enjoyed reading your insights on the word of faith, and I myself am a graduate of Rhema, 1999. Oddly enough, in some ways I felt the same way about some of the things you mentioned before I attended Rhema, and I went to Rhema searching for answers. I did not find my answers there, but rather I found them over a 10 year period after graduation. As fate would have it, I refused to start my ministry until I had all of the answers that I sought, and I myself am not fond of the word of faith. To which, since that time I’ve been working on a series of books that I plan to start my ministry with. My first title will be available as an e-book next month, and I was wondering if you’d be so kind as to read it and give me your input. I say this simply because it covers most every point you made.
Sincerely,
Gary D. Combs
I had written out “My Vision” and confessed it out loud almost everyday, all fourteen pages of it. I prayed in tongues for hours. I read books and listened to hundreds, if not to thousands of Cd’s by the prominent word of faith teachers. I went to seminars, revivals, classes and to all sorts of healing meetings, increase meetings, Holy Ghost meetings, Holy laughter meetings and even to numerous early morning prayer meetings. It was a tradition at our church to meet at four in the morning to pray for two hours. For many years I prayed, believed and confessed miracles, signs and wonders for our ministry. But not much happened along those lines. In fact, I buried a lot of people over those years, including my daughter that died of a brain tumor at the age of fourteen. …..
Reply: Charles Darwin also were like you,his daughter very young died,and he rebelled against God and we Evolution….You went to seminars,on fires for God,like Judas Iscariot,finally betrayed the Lord.You even honor the Movements by saying that you were serious and zealous that you went for early prayer meetings.You credit so much greatness about the Faith movements,but you seem to hate it?…Your bitterness,as your daughter died,cause you to be evil and wicked,and you went astray,as this is your confession!..
Now you hope to bear false witness to attack the Faith movements,and you stayed there for so many years,and if it is false,who can hold so long for ten years?..If ten years is your gauge,I am more.Almost forty years!I appreciate it greater and greater..wow..54 millions in Africa for Christ!….Are you saying confess it out is Unbiblical,or because it is Biblical and scriptural which is why you hated it,is it not?You cannot have success so blame it on the Faith movements,and your blame game get approvals from IDIOTS?…
Mr. Frankie today I witness to a lady. She is a jahova witness and for the last 73 yrs. she has been one. She faithfully goes out every week and is unchangeable in what she believes. She has no quams in telling her side of the story. But she is dead wrong. I did my dead level best to share the truth with her. It was of no avail. But at least she can never stand before God and said she didnt know. The true gospel always points to Jesus.
True gospel always point to Jesus?The Word of Faith movement always point to Jesus.Since they did that always,so they are true,is it not?You made it so simple,and you are right but how is it you still chose to make accusations?No man is perfect,and sure you can find many faults in Pentecostal denominations,but are you sure mainline Churches had none?..They can even say that Billy Graham denies Jesus!!Everybody can make up stories,list out all logical and reasonable attacks against anyone…
@ Frankie, ” and you shall know them by their fruits”
Gary, It is true, and I agree from my experience ( Rhema 1999 – 2000) my faith in God and His Word has guided me after some of the things I saw at RBTC. Many students there have lost loved ones, some even two in one year, and go to Rhema. With me I had unfairly lost a job, but do no regret my year at RBTC. Remission of sin by Christ’s death on the cross of Calvary seemed to be solidly taught and salvation by faith. God gave me two gifts of the Holy Spirit over the years. While at Rhema, in one moment of time, I knew something was wrong. The school attracts people who need family, or were rejected in one way or another. I’d like to read you ebook, although I write this on 2/11/2014. Sometimes I even wonder if he anointing of the Holy Spirit which was so tangible there, was real. At times I think it was. Anyway, after being back home, ‘where I belong’, I was confused about churches and could not feel I fit anywhere after RBTC. Now I am not in a church, mostly home and praying for deliverace from a medical problem.
It took me 10 years to repay a loan plus interest, that in itself was a battle. The leaders at RBTC
are well off. When I decided to leave, one month into 2nd year, they rushed to take my parking pass and did not try to counsel me or listen to me – the individual was not personalized there.
My good friend was an evangelist and died, was not old. Overall, the experiences were good but questionable, when away from the place. Peace, anonymous
Leave them alone,lest haply you were found fighting against God!…It is very evil to speak against God’s servant.Jude warned you never to make RAILING ACCUSATIONS and yet you wanted to do it and encourage others to do it….
Mr Frankie Word of faith is heretical and boarders on the occult. Kenneth Hagin who would be regarded as the main teacher of this heresy did not know his Greek from his elbow. In reality he simply drew on what others have taught before him. The world of metaphysics, that man can created his own little fantasy world as little gods. In reality what they call faith is nothing more than placing your faith in what you speak, rather than in God. You become what even the Mormons feel they have to wait for, godhood. The LIE that satan spawned from the garden was embraced by Hagin Copeland and others.
I tell you now trust in the arm of the flesh >>> your tongue<<< and you will fail.
Trust in the heretical lies of Hagin and co and you will FAIL.
you can as they do believe that Jesus had to atone for sin in hell for three days and soon you will join Hagin in hell as just another false prophet. When Jesus declared it was finished he did so because the atonement was finished. There is no teaching that Jesus took on some stanic nature or was tortured by any demons in hell. Such a teaching is blasphemy to the core. and run contrary to the bulk of scriptural teachings.
Hagin simply daisy chained verses accross the Bible to make them say something they never said. Otherwise he twisted contorted scripture to fit his bizarre teachings. In reality as many believed he became a witch ( more likely demon possessed one at that) he took verses and used them as any witch would use a book of spells and chanted them over his situation to make circumstances conform to his will.
That’s witchcraft and no witch will have any part in the kingdom of God.
In the end he died of what he claimed he was healed from a heart conditioned. No attempt was make to speak life over him and even if some did he remained dead. Sadly because of the suddenness there was no time to repent of his sin. He now awaits his final judgement as a false teacher.
It was not Edwards bitterness that brought him out of the Word of faith but the obvious realities that Word of faith simply does not work. As many many people have come to realise the teaching has less to do with FAITH and more to do with presumption. Edwards no longer decided to live by the lies of the Word of faith teachers. .He is probably one of the nicest guys you can meet. To throw the death of his daughter in his face only show how despicable your own hatred of the truth has become.
TRUE SUCCESS IS NOT MEASURED BY YOUR BANK BALANCE, BUT BY ONES RELATIONSHIP WITH THE LIVING GOD
If you foolishly believe in Hagin Copeland and co you have been lied and deceive. For further info on the heretical teachings of Hagin rhema teachings go to my download box and scroll down for the article on RHEMA THE TRUTH. Probably the 9/10 down from the top. It goes into alot of detail on how Hagin lied about the rhema word
There are enough grave yards filled with people who confessed health wealth and prosperity , only to find the opposite. Their sad stories only alluminate the tragic history of those who placed their faith in men , rather than in scripture. Many died broken and in dispaired because their confessions achieved nothing. Other have been left with the ramifications of lives lost to illness that was easly treated had they recieved the right medical treatement. The history of the word of Faith has been a dispicable one. Unworthy of even the term FAITH!!!
IT IS FAR TOO EASY TO THROW THE ACCUSATION THAT THEY FAILED BECAUSE THEY DID NOT HAVE ENOUGH FAITH, many of these men had remarkable faith, the problem was not the faith but where they placed that faith.
Rom 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Jer 17:5 Thus saith the LORD; Cursed [be] the man that trusteth in man, and maketh flesh his arm, and whose heart departeth from the LORD
UC MINISTRIES
Your 100% correct, about the word of faith. We followed for 16 years, and have tons of stores!
From William Branhan to E.W. Kenyon. In Kenneth Hagin’s book The Midas Touch Chapter 6 Avoiding Abuses and False Practices. Pg. 126-127, Hagin says he made mistakes with the concept of the 100 fold return. I no longer tell people to expect the 100 fold return o their offerings.
And yet we have Keith Moore telling his church volunteers they can claim the 1000 fold return, because they are temple workers, as in Deut 1:11
Leroy Thompson and Creflo Dollar running threw the money on stage.
2012 Billye Brim grandson getting overtaking by demons on stage at her Fall Prayer Confrence.
2006 George and Terri Pearsons, at EMIC begging for money from the congration. Why didn’t they just sow a seed and receive there 100 fold?!? withdrawing from their heavenly account? as its states in Kenneth Copeland Reference Addition Bible.
This is just a small sample of the things we witnessed being at these meeting (opps I mean money raising conventions)
We would like to note that we do not follow Kenneth Hagin anymore either. But it was interesting that he did try to correct those he trained. By then it was too late and fell on deaf ears.
John – After putting into practice Mark 11:24 and not receiving the manifestation of a miracle that I requested from God, He led me to study out miracle faith more thoroughly than just that one particular verse and I then learned from Him in the Scriptures EXACTLY WHY my miracle failed to materialize in this world! The answer is found at the end of Hebrews 11 where great people of faith, who had been approved by God (as I felt that I had been in my own unwavering and selfless faith stand) did not receive the promises of God even though they had been approved by Him. That reason is that God had something better than those promises awaiting them!
When I read that passage (Hebrews 11:39 – 40) in light of my immense disappointment, I felt that God gave me the revelation that He had taken the liberty to override my request for that particular miracle I’d asked him for in order to instead give me something better than that particular miracle in the future! The revelation of that passage included the idea that God never gives us less than what we stand up in faith and ask from Him! No! Instead God boxes Himself into the greater position of giving us exactly what we ask for OR giving us something better than we can think of to ask for.
Now word of faith ministries teach that if our miracle does not manifest we must have done something wrong because God does not lie but this revelation from God on Mark 11:24 combined with Hebrews 11:39 – 40 took me out of that short sighted and therefore false teaching and into the truth of God on standing in faith for particular miracles. After all, the Scriptures tell us that we do not know how to pray as we aught and that God can give us exceedingly abundantly beyond all that we can ask or think, don’t they?
This revelation answers the complaint of those who have stood in faith for the miraculous healing of a loved one who then does not get healed or dies! Word of faith ministries falsely make the one who stood in faith for the miracle feel as though they must have been wavering in their faith or they must have had sin in their heart as the only reasons that the person they were standing in faith for did not recover. That is like calling the person who stood in faith a murderer because their loved one died! This revelation explains that God did not heal them here on earth in spite of our firm faith stand and fervent prayers because He is working on something better for all involved including the dead or the as yet unhealed loved one.
I have a 40 minute, 3 video playlist on You Tube wherein I give my testimony on being led by God into this revelation if you or any of your readers wish to learn more about it. You will find it at….
THANK-YOU UC.
You wrote: you can as they do believe that Jesus had to atone for sin in hell for three days and soon you will join Hagin in hell as just another false prophet.
Reply: Kenneth Haggin teachings which I had known in and out,he never said that.You distorted his doctrines.This lame attacks I had already heard before you were Christian then!This was a lie,and you bought it and now you are another slanderer.Kenneth 60 over years testimony and integrity here on earth,CANNOT BE DISPUTED EXECPT ONE WHO IS DEFINITELY A CHILD OF SATAN would want to slander him….THOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS…
Kenneth’s doctrines was never found to be erroneous by the Evangelicals,and they were very part of the member.All Assemblies of God,and Pentecostal denomination shared the same doctrines,and our afirmation with all in Christendom bore the same Statements of Faith….Our numbers were by the hundreds of millions….No where does the Bible said that bearing true witnesses would be condemned.In fact,my Lord Jesus do declare,those who work Iniquities,which is—make lies,slander,bear false witness,hating your brethren…these are people whom our Lord will denounce,and that is clear…..Your purpose of bringing in ***railing accusations–JUDE already warned you never to do that—yet you disobeyed…..
Benny Hinn was found to have integrity by the Congress,and all the accusations and railing accusations never stick.Now have you seen anyone apologie to him?…Did not David Wilkerson died in the car crash after he ill criticised other mem of God?….
Unreal, unbelievable, reprehensible that you would sit in the judgment seat of such a great man of God as Dave Wilkerson. Anyone could use that kind of argument when any Christian dies in an accident, and it would be baseless. You are just proving the point that there is a characteristic lack of love in the cultic Word of Faith churches.
Frankie now you accuse David Wilkerson as well. Benny like most of the WOf teachers have been well exposed. The crongress were not looking at all the false prophesies he declared, It must also be remembered that Benny is the one who pronounced a curse upon anyone who dared to criticise or reject his ministry. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wAQ5ftiEqE
Yet such a curse has no potency against a child of God. Benny will no doubt continue to be exposed.
The doctrine of Jesus going to hell and suffering under the heel of demons was a basic WOF teaching and has been for many years. >>>>This is common knowledge<<<<<
http://www.cuttingedge.org/News/n1825.html (See the full aticle )
"Physical death would not remove our sins. He tasted death for every man – spiritual death. Jesus is the first person ever to be born again. Why did HIS spirit need to be born again? Because it was estranged from God." ("The Name Of Jesus", Kenneth E. Hagin, pp. 29-30.)]
You will not be able to understand the authority in the name of Jesus until you understand this fact Down in the prison house of suffering down in hell itself Jesus satisfied the claims of justice on the behalf of each one of us, because He died as our substitute" (Ibid.. p. 33.)
This is simply heresy !!!!
"No, 'thou are my son, this day have I begotten thee' is not talking about the day He took upon Himself a body. Then what day was it? When was it that Jesus was begotten? When He was raised up. On that Resurrection morn! Why did He need to be begotten or born? Because He became like we were, separated from God. Because He tasted death for every man, His spirit, His Inner man, went to hell in our place." (Ibid., p. 29.)
This is heresy!!!!
The word Begoten does not mean Born again. Thats how dumb Hagin was. Two very diferent wods and meanings.
Hagin had absolutly NO CLUE as to what scripture taught.
http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/word-faith2.html
Roots of the Word of Faith/Positive Confession Movement
"Much of Kenyon's theories are practiced, and his writings plagiarized by the word of faith/positive confession promulgators. The positive confession movement, also known as the "faith movement," profess characteristics in their teachings that resemble either identical, or modifications of the foundational doctrines of E.W. Kenyon. The five major doctrines prominent are: faith in faith; guaranteed health; wealth/prosperity; spiritual death of Christ; and the view that Christians are little gods. These doctrines all originated with Kenyon. [Michael G. Moriarty, The New Charismatics (Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids, Michigan), p. 80.]. As any one of these doctrines can be analyzed at length, the "spiritual death" of Jesus is the one I will deal with – the most erroneous doctrine of them all"
In the end Hagin was exposed as another cult leader, promoting his own agenda. He decieved countless and sady th worst part is that he decieved himself the most. The majority of those who became wrapped up in these heresis simply never realised to the full extent of the heresy. They were manipulated and very carefully conned.
I have talked to countless people who were heavly into the WOF teachings , who would swear blind that Hagin never taught these thngs, yet in a matter of minutes they are coming out with the very doctrines they claim Hagin never taught. Word for word. Quoting verbatum. To say the least it was the strangest think to see. Blindness to the ninth degree. Today the information on Hagin and the WOF is so extensive , quoting him word for word. It is stil remarkable that there are still some die hards out there.
Your anger is not really directed at me but at yourself for being taken in. Sadly many many people were. But we can thank God that many many have come to the realisation and fled these false teachers and their occult
ideas.
I would encourage you to read this article which shows just how Hagin lied about his “rhema” The flag ship and central core to his teachings.
https://www.box.com/s/y7yhmdpq0neu2qq08cl0
Well frankie you are well over the top. Now you accuse David Wilkerson as well.
Me: Did David Wilkerson died disgracefully and violently in a car crashed?He did criticised Benny Hinn and Joel Osteen,did he not?Did he not speak evil of our brethren?Just like yoy,can you deny you are not speaking evil against your brethren?
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Benny like most of the WOf teachers have been well exposed. The crongress were not looking at all the false prophesies he declared, nor the lies and cheap con tricks he used to lure people. It seems you cant even get the facts right to save yourself.
Me: Benny Hinn is exposed as a true teacher of God Words,verified,vetted and trusted by all of us even till this day.We bear witness that he is true,and he is given the platform by all Evangelical and ALL OF OUR DENOMINATIONS.Our investigations found him to be sound,and is a true servant of God.
Congress look over his finances,and found him to be clean,but what about all those accusations about his Finances,and supposed wrong doings of his finances,and did people apologise to him?
How did you know his prophecies are false,and while I find him spot on and correct,why did you find it otherwise?.He has sucess and save many souls for God,and he worship God,and his doctrines are sound,and Christians all over the world can testify for you.
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The doctrine of Jesus going to hell and suffering under the heel of demons was a basic WOF teaching and has been for many years. >>>>This is common knowledge<<<<< http://www.cuttingedge.org/News/n1825.html (See the full aticle ) "Physical death would not remove our sins. He tasted death for every man – spiritual death. Jesus is the first person ever to be born again. Why did HIS spirit need to be born again? Because it was estranged from God." ("The Name Of Jesus", Kenneth E. Hagin, pp. 29-30.)]..
Me: It was Apostle Creed,and every denomination in Christendom believe and confess that Jesus went to Hell.Now which part you don't understand?Did Jesus tasted spiritual death for us,or did He go to Hell?Was Jesus born again?…You can dispute that interpretation,but you can never dispute the way it was taught by a Teacher of God's words….Jesus was given a new resurrected body,even for anyone to use the words Born Again for Jesus it still do justice to the understanding of scriptures.
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You will not be able to understand the authority in the name of Jesus until you understand this fact Down in the prison house of suffering down in hell itself Jesus satisfied the claims of justice on the behalf of each one of us, because He died as our substitute" (Ibid.. p. 33.) This is simply heresy !!!!
Me: Jesus died for us,and you called that heresies?Jesus went to Hell is what all Christendom believed,now are you a cult or not an Evangelical?Jesus is our substitute and our saviour,and yet called that heresies?It is your attack which is heresies,and you distort the scriptures!
Did Jesus satisfies the claims of Justice? Since Jesus did,so are you not an heretic yourself by making allegations on this point?
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"No, 'thou are my son, this day have I begotten thee' is not talking about the day He took upon Himself a body. Then what day was it? When was it that Jesus was begotten? When He was raised up. On that Resurrection morn! Why did He need to be begotten or born? Because He became like we were, separated from God. Because He tasted death for every man, His spirit, His Inner man, went to hell in our place." (Ibid., p. 29.) This is heresy!!!! Hagin had absolutly NO CLUE as to what scripture taught.
Me: Basically Kenneth is teaching died for our sins and Jesus is our saviour.Since you dispute that,you are of the devils.Period.
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ttp://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/word-faith2.html Roots of the Word of Faith/Positive Confession
Me: This Office of Satan,this evil works had been known and studied and understood by me for so long a time since it was posted….You mean you don't know this ""deceptionin the church""railing accusations were themselves inspired by Satan?You are behind time and too immature to know about discernment….
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Movement "Much of Kenyon's theories are practiced, and his writings plagiarized by the word of faith/positive confession promulgators. The positive confession movement, also known as the "faith movement," profess characteristics in their teachings that resemble either identical, or modifications of the foundational doctrines of E.W. Kenyon. The five major doctrines prominent are: faith in faith; guaranteed health; wealth/prosperity; spiritual death of Christ; and the view that Christians are little gods. These doctrines all originated with Kenyon. [Michael G. Moriarty, The New Charismatics (Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids, Michigan), p. 80.]. As any one of these doctrines can be analyzed at length, the "spiritual death" of Jesus is the one I will deal with – the most erroneous doctrine of them all" In the end Hagin was exposed as another cult leader, promoting his own agenda. He decieved countless and sady th worst part is that he decieved himself the most. The majority of those who became wrapped up in these heresis simply never realised to the full extent of the heresy. He were manipulated and very carefully conned. I have talked to countless people who were heavly into the WOF teachings , who would swear blind that Hagin never taught these thngs, yet in a matter of minutes they are coming out with the very doctrines they claim Hagin never taught. Word for word. Quoting verbatum. To say the least it was the strangest think to see. Blindness to the ninth degree. Today the information on Hagin and he WOF is so extensive , quoting him word for word. It is stil remarkable that there are still some die hards out there. Your anger is not really directed at me but at yourself for being taken in. Sadly many many people were. But we can thank God that many many have come to the realisation and fled these false teachers and their occult ideas.
Me: These were old recycled attacks which is inspired by Satan and known for a long time,and for each passing moments of my life,I watch bitter people and drop out of our Faith Movement swould embraced their slanders.
The truth is,these false accusers are turning you to become another slanderers,another false witnesses so that you will lose your Life with God,make you twice the child fo Hell.You think they are trying to warn you of false teachers,where they themselves are real false teachers,disguised as angels of light to deceive you!They want you to hurt and bear false witness against God's servants,and you just did.
It is you who are blind to the core.The Holy Spirit is bearing witness that Kenneth E Haggin is given the true teachings,and the Lord Jesus personally visits him.This is his witness,so either one of you will be condemned,and if Kenneth is true servants of God,and he is,because he preach Jesus as the saviour,as the Lord,Jesus is the saviour,Hell- fires is real,Heaven is Real,and his doctrines are accepted by Christendom today,and we are witnesses.
You opposed him and set yourself apart therefore,you are deceived,and can you see your names in the Lamb book of life by doing such dirty works?….Satan is an accsuer of our brethren…you took his office,and you are adament in making railing accusations,again and again–you don't read Jude at all,is it not?No slanderers and liar will inherit the Kingdom of God…..During his time here,Kenneth claimed to have been visted by Lord Jesus 8 times.If he bears false witness,a thousand times deeper hell will not be enough for him.If he is true,then you will go to a deeper hell….For you seek to tear the entire bodies of Christ,and hindered the gospel of the Lord Jesus,and your bitterness which was expressed here,convicts your follies.You are hindering millions to Christ.I have more pity for Hitler who killed 6 millions Jews than for anyone to hinder the Gospel of my Lord Jesus working through His servants,the potentials of saving billions in these last days before the Bridegroom returns!
Any way let them take a seat and Satan be honoured by their accusations. Shame on you guys with your jealousness.
LOL DRIVEL!!!!!!!! You seem to have a deep seated hatred of any and all truth, God will deal with you in due course. The only place hagin and co point to is themselves. Another Jesus and another gospel. Follow hagin and you will be lost. Stark reality but one that is all too clear. You may hate the truth with a passion but its the only truth that will set you free. Hagin lies will bare ungodly fruit. Many have reaped a whirlwind in that regard.
I have great anger against all people who try to hurt my MASTER LORD JESUS and those who lead people to slander and hate and cause division in Christendom,and I made it clear,and you called that as deep seated hatred of me?You confessed for having your 14 yea old child died without getting healed by God through prayers and confessions,and claims…so it is you who is in deep seated hatred which blinded your eyes!
I believe and show all that we must bear false witness,but you insist on bearing false witnesses,and you said I have deep seated hatred?…You betrayed and become traitors to Faith movement,and you say now…who really has deep seated hatred?…You display as one who has deep seated hatred here,and you counter it and say ME?….You have just prophesied your own serious problems..God will deal with you!…I pray God have mercies on you and grant you repentence perhaps you will stop bearing false witness again!
I believe and show all that we must bear”” false”””” witness….spelling error…I SHOW ALL PEOPLE HERE TO BEAR TRUE WITNESS ONLY.FOR FALSE WITNESS BEARING MEANT ONE IS WORKING INIQUITIES,AND JESUS DEAL WITH THOSE WHO SLANDERS IS THIS—DEPART FROM ME YOU WHO WORK INIQUITIES,WORK SLANDERS,AND WORK HATRED AGAINTS YOUR BRETHREN…
Many a cult church is formed around and through family dynasties…..almost as though they were to be worshipped! An indoctrination film was shown to first year students about the founders’ early years. I’d rather study the lineage of our Lord Jesus Christ. I was mind controlled, searching for God’s love and protection after some losses. In that respect, many are vulnerable people there, and the vulnerable get taken advantage of. I still get drawn thinking about healing school.
I do hope people still stuck there can get free, especially the leaders. We need to pray for them.
So you admit to the anger, You appear to hate David Wilkerson for who know what. Exposing the riff raft I presume. You have hatred towards mr Edwards because he saw the Wof faith for what it was. No doubt you appear to have hatred towards me because I expose Hagin and co. But at NO time have you shown a moment consideration at the evidence provided. Which even the slightest search on google would produce a wealth of information. Quoting what these men have taught word for word from their own teachings. Teachings which so far you have not even tried to refute and I suspect cannot!!!!. Your anger and rage has both blinded you to men who would encourage and help you. I pray that God would open blind eyes to see and give you a heart to receive what has been shared. But this anger I have no real time for. The information has been posted. Reject it to your own cost. But I hope God will lead you to hear him . Renounce these heresies and find true peace . Until you do I doubt you will find the peace you desperately long for.
So you admit to the anger, You appear to hate David Wilkerson for who know what. Exposing the riff raft I presume.
My Reply: David Wilkerson also claimed to expose Joel Osteen/Benny Hinn.I love this guy alot and he did great for the Lord’s Kingdom and that service Nicky Cruz,The cross of the switch blade,it was wonderful.
How can I hate anyone?A man of God like him could also be in Judgment,and it is a fact he died violently,tragically and shamefully in an accident.
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You have hatred towards mr Edwards because he saw the Wof faith for what it was.
Me: Do I hate him?I am trying to save him,bless him with another perspective and be a true witness,so that he will repent and know the truth and the truth shall make him free!As accuser of our brethren,that is a Satanic job.Why fit in for him?
Our Faith movements for the Lord has become unstoppable,for Jesus glory alone,and do you think all these slanders can destroy us all?All these poisons of the well,it will not succeed!I bothered to enlighten you,but because of your blindness and immaturity,you just dig deeper,dig your own grounds!
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No doubt you appear to have hatred towards me because I expose Hagin and co. But at NO time have you shown a moment consideration at the evidence provided.
Reply: Rhema Institute and Kenneth E Haggins’teachings stand strong.In his 60 years of ministries,where have you seen his defeat?Have I not shown you evidence AND YOU JUST DENY IT?
Kenneth E Haggin seen the Lord Jesus face to face 8 times.He was a prophet.He preached the Gospel.He saw Hell fires and warned the world.
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Which even the slightest search on google would produce a wealth of information. Quoting what these men have taught word for word from their own teachings. Teachings which so far you have not even tried to refute and I suspect cannot!!!!.
Reply: Apologetics Index,CRI,Berean,Let Us reason ministries,Reformation……I despised them already!!!!
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Your anger and rage has both blinded you to men who would encourage and help you. I pray that God would open blind eyes to see and give you a heart to receive what has been shared. But this anger I have no real time for. The information has been posted. Reject it to your own cost. But I hope God will lead you to hear him . Renounce these heresies and fins true peace . Until you do I doubt you will find the peace you desperately long for.
Reply: You know so little of real peace,and the Positive Confessions,and the Power of the Holy Ghost,and I speak in tongues daily,fill with joys unspeakable!!!I command the fierce demons and they flees!I lay hands on the sick,and they recover!I preach Jesus as Lord and Saviour with great power and strength,as I always do!I raised the dead and gave her life in Jesus name.It is for your benefits and not mine I testify all these to you.
That is a huge error, for the Word, inspired by the Holy Spirit, declares no man has seen God and His ways are past finding out. I have had 2 visions, one in the opened sky and the other at my mother’s funeral. Jesus gave The Holy Spirit to lead, comfort and guide us. He is coming back and then all men will see him.
ITS MAGIC AND GOD CONDEMNS IT.
Spell:
A spell is a spoken or written formula that when used in an act of magick is intended to cause or influence a particular course of events.
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Hagin took certain scriptures, wrapped them together and then made a confession of them. With the hope that what he confessed he would possess. Faith in ones confession is nothing more than witchcraft and the casting of a spell . A Positive or negative confession achieves a result based not upon ones trust in God, but in ones owns confession. Sickness if it’s a negative confession, prosperity and health is it comes from a positive confession. Hagin thought to create his own world as a little god over that world. This inevitably produces a pride in one’s own ability to manifest. God himself is even bound by the words ones speak. Such is the blindness which comes with it. In the end Hagin could not despite all his confessions keep himself from dying. Such is the legacy that numerous tombstones of the dead should remind us that power over life and death is in the hands of God and not in what we speak.
The world is reminded of the final indignity of a man being helped around a room .possessed by a demon spirit, his tongue darting in and out as a serpent does. Manifestation like some puppet on a string a demonic influence over everyone in the room. A show case of bedlam and confusion.
Gal 5:19-21 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, WITCHCRAFT, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that THEY WHICH DO SUCH THINGS SHALL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD.
Even a brief search on the subject of how to cast a spell outlines Hagin beliefs exactly. The fact he shrouded them in Christian terminology does not detract the occult aspect to them. Those who practice such wickedness also make claims that its works. But the unbiblical aspect is all too clear.
Seriously take heed or take responsibility for the occult and face the consequences. In the end its your choice .
Hagin took certain scriptures, wrapped them together and then made a confession of them.
Reply:Since you implied that certain scriptures are not worthy,and implied taken scripturs to confesse them as though it is wrong,are you not a disbeliever of Bible?Since you are not in the belief of God’s Words,and despiwsed Hagin who use God’s words,then which book did you honor?
The Words of God is being held in high esteem by us,and since you declare your disdain of God’s words,and disdain on Hagin use of God’s Words,are you not a child of the Devils?
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With the hope that what he confessed he would possess.
Reply: Are you a kindergarten minded person?Obviously we hope to get what we confess!This is the desires and cries of every human heart,to be free from sicknesses and poverty.Since you showed agendas on how you hated people from getting bless,are you not possessed by Cain’s spirit?
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Faith in ones confession is nothing more than witchcraft and the casting of a spell . A Positive or negative confession achieves a result based not upon ones trust in God, but in ones owns confession.
Reply: There you said Hagin use God’s words,certain scriptures,scriptures were written for us,is it not,for our BREAD?We confess God’s words is not actions of trust,why do it?How would you know it was done not out of trust?Maybe you can say we do it hypocritically?I also can accused you of hidden agendas without prove,isn’t it?You are dumb.Period.
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Sickness if it’s a negative confession, prosperity and health is it comes from a positive confession.
Reply: We all understood the full teachings and elaboration,but here you didn’t show the full sides of his teachings.Life and death is in the power of our Tongues.Being negative confessions bring sickness is the idea nad doctrines of the Bible,why dispute with God “s word?Speaking evil words and idle words have consequences,only a deceiver like you were made unaware.
Properity and Health comes from a positive confession,or right confessions,and our conversations order aright,is what the Bible teaches.This is very valid statements,and one cannot gainsay against it.
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Hagin thought to create his own world as a little god over that world.
Reply: It was Jesus who said that..ye are god…So why do you dispute Jesus teachings?If you don’t want to create your own world of Charity and Blessings for the people,for the lost and for sick,a world where there is a Bible school for all people,and this type of world Hagin created,only Satan dislike it and you also in Christendom!!!
Hagin received God’s divine nature,partook God nature,and the Spirit of God lives inside of him,….should he use his ability and power God had given him to create a better world for the lost and strengthen his brethren?
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This inevitably produces a pride in one’s own ability to manifest. God himself is even bound by the words ones speak.
Reply: God gave us ability to perform,and we have the ability to perform.Whether it will lead one to pride or to humility,that is beside the point.God gave us ability and we should hide our talents,is that correct for you? No wonder you became so lame and dumb!
God honors His words is not the same as your evil sugeestions that we manipulated God and His words.That is a total different understanding of the Bible.Your deceits came from a darkend hearts and you purposely speak for the Devils.
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Such is the blindness which comes with it. In the end Hagin could not despite all his confessions keep himself from dying.
Reply: Hagin taught that a man’s life is 70 or 80s,and that is human life’s span,include his own.He lived above 80,and that is a positive testimony of God’s words which stick,anad he honors God’s words and lead by example.Now,don’t you try to make yourself dumb and erratice and sarcastic to say that Hagin cannot keep himself from dying?…What is the purpose of trying to be as obnoxious and nasty to slander him?…Jesus,if you are the Son of God,come down from the cross…you sound like the Devils isn’t it?
Such is the legacy that numerous tombstones of the dead should remind us that power over life and death is in the hands of God and not in what we speak.
The world is reminded of the final indignity of a man being helped around a room .possessed by a demon spirit, his tongue darting in and out as a serpent does. Manifestation like some puppet on a string a demonic influence over everyone in the room. A show case of bedlam and confusion.
Gal 5:19-21 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are [these]; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, WITCHCRAFT, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told [you] in time past, that THEY WHICH DO SUCH THINGS SHALL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM OF GOD.
Even a brief search on the subject of how to cast a spell outlines Hagin beliefs exactly. The fact he shrouded them in Christian terminology does not detract the occult aspect to them. Those who practice such wickedness also make claims that its works. But the unbiblical aspect is all too clear.
Seriously take heed or take responsibility for the occult and face the consequences. In the end its your choice .
THE HERETICAL TEACHINGS OF, KENNETH HAGIN. (Well some of them)
Publication: “Word of Faith” magazine
Christ’s physical death on the cross was not enough to save us.
How Jesus obtained His Name, Tape 44H01
Jesus tasted spiritual death.
How Jesus obtained His Name, Tape 44H01
The Christian “is as much an incarnation as was Jesus of Nazareth.”
“The Incarnation,” The Word of Faith (Dec. 1980)
“[Man] was created on terms of equality with God, and he could stand in God’s presence without any consciousness of inferiority…God made us as much like Himself as possible…He made us the same class of being that He is Himself…Man lived in the realm of God. He lived on terms equal with God…[The] believer is called Christ…That’s who we are; we’re Christ”
“Zoe: The God-Kind of Life,” 1989. pp. 35-36, 41
“Every man who has been born again is an incarnation and Christianity is a miracle. The believer is as much an incarnation as was Jesus of Nazareth”
“The Incarnation,” The Word of Faith 13, December, 1980
“You are as much the incarnation of God as Jesus Christ was…the believer is as much an incarnation as was Jesus of Nazareth.”
“Word Of Faith” Dec. 1980, p. 14
“Why did He need to be begotten or born? Because He became like we were – separated from God. Because He tasted spiritual death for every man. And His spirit and inner men went to hell in my place. Can’t you see that? Physical death wouldn’t remove your sins. He’s tasted death for every man. He’s talking about tasting spiritual death. Jesus is the first person that was ever born again. Why did His spirit need to be born again? Because it was estranged from God.” (Kenneth Hagin, “How Jesus obtained His Name”
Tape #44-H01
Word-Faith Movement
Also known as “Name-in-Claim-it,” “Health and Wealth Gospel,” “Positive Confession,” “Word of Faith,” etc.
Word-Faith teachers owe their ancestry to groups like Christian Science, Swedenborgianism, Theosophy, Science of Mind, and New Thought–not to classical Pentecostalism. It reveals that at their very core, Word-Faith teachings are corrupt. Their undeniable derivation is cultish, not Christian. The sad truth is that the gospel proclaimed by the Word-Faith movement is not the gospel of the New Testament. Word-Faith doctrine is a mongrel system, a blend of mysticism, dualism, and gnosticism that borrows generously from the teachings of the metaphysical cults. The Word-Faith movement may be the most dangerous false system that has grown out of the charismatic movement so far, because so many charismatics are unsure of the finality of Scripture
John MacArthur, Charismatic Chaos, p. 290
There are many peculiar ideas and practices in the Faith theology, but what merits it the label of heresy are the following: 1) its deistic view of God, who must dance to men’s attempts to manipulate the spiritual laws of the universe; 2) its demonic view of Christ, who was filled with “the Satanic nature” and must be “born again in hell; 3) its gnostic view of revelation, which demands denial of the physical senses and classifies Christians by their willingness to do so; and 4) its metaphysical view of salvation, which deifies man and spiritualizes the atonement, locating it in hell rather than on the cross, thereby subverting the crucial biblical belief that it is Christ’s physical death and shed blood, which alone atone for sin. All four of these heresies may be accounted for by Kenyon’s syncretism of methaphysical thought with traditional biblical doctrine”
D.R. McConnell, A Different Gospel
Source appologetics index/
Now frankie instead of just repeating more word of faith drivel I suggest you take the time to digest what has already been shared. Nowever if you have no concern for the truth then its unlikely any off these sites will help.,
http://www.apologeticsindex.org/w00.html#wordf wealth of articles which will answer your issues.
AN EXAMINATION OF THE WORD-FAITH MOVEMENT by Richard J. Vincent http://www.biblebb.com/files/WRDFAITH.HTM
My Word of Faith Testimony by Tricia Booth (Tillin) http://www.birthpangs.org/articles/wof/mytest.html
Kenneth Copeland http://www.apologeticsindex.org/c53.html
I believe that when I had gone through those Apologetics slanders then,you weren’t even a Christian!John Macarthur had very right doctrines of Christ’s Salvation and that is very true.But,his slanders against fellow brethren are very contagious,and he is a wolf in sheep clothings….He is a false teacher and led people to bear false witness….Apologetics Index were great in some areas about CULTS,but Satan already infiltrated and also use them to hurt true servants of God….Flee from false accusers!….No one who is a false witnesses had eternal life iin him…THE SADDEST EPISODES OF YOU SERIOUSLY DUMB GUYS WERE,YOU WERE MISLED AND WAS MADE TWICE OF HELL-CHILD- BY THIS PHARISEE,AND YOU REMAIN IN IGNORANT….The real disguised as angels of light,the true false teachers are those who sat at the feet of Satan and inspired others to bear false witness and use slanders.Their purpose is to deceive you and make you slanders also,and best of all—TO CON YOU TO JUMP INTO WRONG CONCLUSION,AND THERE YOUR SOUL WILL BE CONDEMNED!…Whether or not you are aware of not,ignorant or stupid or what,as long as you accuse and hurt the Lord’s ministries,and cast disunity among His brethren,sins are at the doors…and you will have your name erase from the Lamb book of life because of your sins….Why be a busy body,and spread poisons anad spread ill will,and you suppose by exposing others,in such pretext,did you not see you are exhibiting hatred and jealousies and envies,but in the name of TRYING to expose false Teachers,and in the name of Righteousness?
D.R. McConnell, A Different Gospel….He is a well known false teacher for a long time.
Mr frankie what is wrong with you. Yes the scripture does say jesus went to hell but hell or hades has to parts. The place of torment and the righteous abode of the dead. Jesus told the thief on the cross ” This day you will be with me in paridise.” The righteous bode of the dead or the paridise side is Abraham bossom. It was the waiting place untill the messiah would come and take them with hiim to be with the father. Jesus said on the cross I commend my spirit to you and gave up the ghost and died. It is so foreign to christdeom the doctrine that the word of faith espouses to that even the holy spirit rejects it. When in bible time the greek word to fullfill the contract is finished it is tetelisti which means it is finished and fulfilled. Your attitude reaks of word of faith not the fruit of the spirit . Please be fore it is to late repent The things in the word of faith blab it and claim it all the way to little god
docrine is frankly out of the sphere of orthedoxy.
To day the word of faith preacher is like the snake salesman of the old west . He had some medicine that would cure all aliments. His wagon was always colorful and as long as you had 2 bits you could buy this elexier and you would recover. But usually their wasnt any thing but colored water. Buy the time you discovered that it was fake he was long gone. The fact remains that God is supreme and he did give his son to shed his blood on calvary so we could have eternal life. False doctrine has infitrated the chuch and is a live and well. Just as the scales fell off of paul I to have had the scales fall of of my eyes. I can see clearly and realize that we are in the great falling away. Not from church so much but from sound doctrine. Just as satan promised adam and eve that if they ate from the tree of knowledge in the garden they too would be like god.their eyes would be open. The word of faith has promised that by confessing what they want they could have what they say. But it doesnt work that way because if we could use Gods word like a slot machine we too would be pulling that handle and be millionares you dont know what spirit you are. I came in to God during the Jesus movement. But before that We had been promised a bill of goods .
We could drop A hit of acid and go into anorther diminsion and expand our knowledge. But when we found out who was behind that movement and we were betrayed it made us mad. We sought for the truth. And I want to say the so called word of faith movement is false because it comes into conflict with the word of God. You can take the word of god and make it say what you want it to say and the berean searched the scriptures and proved what was said was the truth . I heard the other day this is the knew reliegion but its roots go back 6000 years. To day Satan has infitrated the church. God has never promised us a rose garden but he has instead promised us the rose of sharran. Thank.-you
Frankie this web site is not here for you to drum your witchcraft. You have made it clear that you have anger and rage against numerous people. That is a basic problem with many who are involved with this teachings. You hate to be exposed an what manifests itself in you is this rage and hatred. I have come accross this many times in the past in debating with those who hold to this heresy.
Information of the word of faith heresy is vast. And goes into a great deal of detail. Probably more so than I have time for right now. Which is why I posted them. They explore this issue in great detail.
You have made it clear that you are unwilling to look at the information. Some of which also containes other testimonies by people who were into this teachings and have now found true peace and reconciliation with God. I appreciate that some of the links on appologetic index have gone down. Many of the articles themselves can still be found. I hope to post a selection of them on my web site for future reference for those who are interested to know.
So far you have simply confirmed that what these men teach is correct. The sad part is that its heresy. They are following another gospel , another Jesus and another faith.
Hagins famous teaching on the rhema word is so debunked thats almost laughable that anyone should take this con artist seriously . That teaching was sunked some time ago. Again another article that you are obviously too afraid to look at.
I appreciate that fear is part of the condition. Any form of negativity especially in what you might accidently blurt out becomes a supertitious burden which must be ofset by a positive statement to overide the negative,
True Biblical faith is not rested on what I confess, but in whom I confess. My faith rests in the living God who knows me.
The statement that life and death is in the tongue was simply a statement about how people can be encourage or discourage one another. It ws never intended to become some metaphical source to create your own little world. As I said Hagin twisted scripture out of context, daisy chained them together to create a warlocks book of spells. The constant repitition of selective verses , rather than an understanding of the Bible as a whole.
Solomon in proverbs would often say the same thing but say it differently.
Prov. 12:17-19: “He who speaks truth declares righteousness, but a false witness, deceit. There is one who speaks like the piercings of a sword, But the tongue of the wise promotes health. The truthful lip shall be established forever, but a lying tongue is but for a moment.”
Prov. 16:24: “Pleasant words are like a honeycomb, sweetness to the soul and health to the bones.”
Prov. 4:10-13: “Hear, my son, and receive my sayings, and the years of your life will be many. I have taught you in the way of wisdom; I have led you in right paths. When you walk, your steps will not be hindered, and when you run, you will not stumble. Take firm hold of instruction, do not let go; keep her, for she is your life.”
All these verses are saying the same thing as Prov 18 is saying. The truth leads the soul to righteousness and life.
Prov 6: 2 12: 12-15 , 17 -28. 18: 7-8 all follow in the same trend. Rather than ripping a single verse out of context I suugest you look at all of these verses and clearly Solomon never intended Prov 18 to be more than a moralistic statement about good and bad. metaphysics was never in Solomons mind. What he had to say was very down to earth and practicle.
As for the idea that you are some sort of demi god, think again. What Jesus meant by it was not a good think but a judgement upon those who believe they were. The term God in Ps 82 was related to when Moses struggled with Judging over the people. God ordained Judges from every tribe to minister to the people. They were called Elohims gods. But as Ps 82 says they would die like men. They judged incorrectly They became corrupted by the power that God had ordained . True Gods dont not Die. God made it clear there was to be only ONE GOD and he was it. Remember that Moses was only to be seen as a God to pharoah, Moses was no God to his people or his family. To believe that you have become god is blasphemy.
Every man who claims he is some little god in Gods class stands under the judgement of God just as Ps 82 says. All who try and ascend the hill of the Lord by any other way than trusting Christ and christ alone is in for a sudden shock.
U wrote: Every man who claims he is some little god in Gods class stands under the judgement of God just as Ps 82 says.
Reply: Ps 82:6,7…I have said,Ye are gods;and all of you are children of the most high.But ye shall die like men….Claiming to be some god does stand under Judgment of God?…as you said and teach?Your basis is on verse 7…right?….Claiming me to be children of God,within the same verse of verse 6,also claiming to be children of God,shall alsol be under judgment …correct?…….
OS IN OTHER WORDS,YOU PROCLAIMED YOUR SELF AND CONFESS YOURSELF AS A CHILD OF SATAN AND YOU WILL NOT STAND CONDEMN…BECAUSE YOU STAND AS THE ACCUSER OF OUR BRETHREN,THE VERY OFFICE OF SATAN,..RIGHT?
It was Jesus who said…ye are gods?…John 10:34….SINCE YOU DISPUTE THE VERY WORDS OF MY LORD jESUS CHRIST,SEEK TO DISTORT THE SCRIPTURES,WHAT ARE YOU THEN?
iT WAS THIS ISSUE OF ”gods”in dispute and you seem so confused!!!!verse 35….are ye god,as the scripture cannot be broken,or are you trying to the words of Jesus again?….You also said that we who agree with the Words of Jesus are condemned,so you who oppose the wowrds of Jesus,then who are you?…The child of the darkness,is it not true?
You are indeed in confusion Frankie!!!
Psa 82:1 ¶ [[A Psalm of Asaph.]] God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods. How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah. Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy. Deliver the poor and needy: rid [them] out of the hand of the wicked. They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
This is what Jesus was referring to. These were judges raised up to deal in matters of the law. It failed because these men became corrupted. The wilderness saw the majority of them die except Joshua and Caleb of that generation who survived to pass into the promised land
I suppose to you this is not judgement? Life and times of these wicked witches aka Hagin and co are indeed under the judgement of the LIVING GOD. If you practice these things then you are a witch and will be judged as such. Believe me you are in a serious situation.
Again you ignorance is so blatant to ignore the evidence that Hagin preached another gospel and another Jesus. So you believe yourself to be another god then???
Mar 12:32 And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is ONE God; and there is none other but he:
1Ti 2:5 For [there is] ONE God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.
1Cr 8:4 As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol [is] nothing in the world, and that [there is] none other God but ONE.
1Cr 8:6 But to us [there is but] ONE God, the Father, of whom [are] all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom [are] all things, and we by him.
That means there can be only ONE TRUE and LIVING GOD> To claim yourself a little god in Gods class is to be an usurper to the throne. Any true Christian would know and realize that this is an area you dont touch. because you dont touch the glory of God. Nor will he share that glory. It means you are believing the same lie satan used in the garden. No where in scripture does it say that man is divine. A God among other true Gods. That Frankie is called polytheism and is more like Mormonism than Christianity. You have to realize that you are not a true christian as long as you promote this heresy. Especially as so much HAS BEEN WRITTEN EXPOSING IT AS SUCH. you are without excuse Frankie.
I doubt if you have checked out the information posted or refered to. The need to rip verses out of context is just another aspect of the Word of faith heresy. You quoted verses 6, 7 to the exclusion of the rest of that chapter. History showed what happened to these men, they all died!!
Gen 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
If we are to believe what the snake said then such a condition was anything but a curse. Mankind fell into the most horrendous predicament.
U :This is what Jesus was referring to.
Me: Jesus quoted these words when He was challenged,”” ye are gods”” was in respone of the wrong perceptions of the Pharisees.I quoted the scriptures upon your same erroneous view of the scriptures.Why did you want to dispute the words of Jesus?
U: These were judges raised up to deal in matters of the law. It failed because these men became corrupted. The wilderness saw the majority of them die except Joshua and Caleb of that generation who survived to pass into the promised land ..
Me: What relevance to the issues on”Ye are gods””?…Are you mentally fit here?
U”:Life and times of these wicked witches aka Hagin and co are indeed under the judgement of the LIVING GOD.
Me: Micheal arc Angel dare not bring railing accusations at Satan.Jude reveals a signifcance aspects of people who bring railing accusation at men of God,and they are brute beasts,twice dead,clouds without water…people such as you.You cannot see yourself as one making accusation at man of God Hagin,or r u not making Railing accusations now even on me as witch?
You dare say that we are in God’s judgment,now you had it on yourself…all for nothing by pronouncement of Judgments,and your ignorance hurt yourself….David Wilkerson was a man of God,but his railing accusation against other men of God,is not without reasons,nor his own interpretations illogical–but he died in a car crashed,violently and shamefully.
You: That means there can be only ONE TRUE and LIVING GOD> To claim yourself a little god in Gods class is to be an usurper to the throne.
Me: Jesus quote the scriptures””ÿe are gods””,and Moses was like a god to Israelites according to what God said.Paul already said we are sitted together with Christ in the Heavenly places,so where is the Usurper accusations of God’s throne,on such charges able to stick?
Are you simply dumb or what?
You: No where in scripture does it say that man is divine.
Me: Since you neither partook God’s divine nature,still in the carnal flesh,how can you know we had already partook God’s divine nature,as Peter told us,but you didn’t know at all?Since you made so much errors and stupidities here,are trying to credit me for bringing Truths to all who read here,and you chose to exhibit your own follies?
Man was created in God’s image,and it is theologically correct to say we are made in God’s class.If you don’t believe we are created in God’s image and in God’s class,suit yourself.
Every Christian was made divine and received power after the Holy Ghost came upon them,like the disciples of Jesus,did miracles–if they are not divine,then are they not man of sinful nature again,or carnal Flesh?
We believe in One God,and we are gods,and just because we are gods does than mean we negate our Faith in One God?Moses was named god,so people who believe that must be polygamists,is that not your silly understanding?
Satan was also named as god of this world.So it meant we Christians are polygamist because we believe Satan is god of this world?
Jesus said ye are gods…go ahead and dispute his words again!…If you cannot believe in what my Lord says,that is your problem.
Oooooh what anger. Once again this is typical of those who are into this heresy, It’s the spirits that are within you reacting. There is nothing Holy About them.
Like always the simply statement “ye are Gods,” is taken out of context That term has to be understood in relation to what Jesus meant. Obviously you do not seem have the aptitude to look further than the term. To take it an apply it to yourself is laughable. Jesus was not speaking to you. But something’s else. Psalm 82. And psalm 82 is speaking about a specific incident in scripture.
Ex 21: 6 Then his master shall bring him unto the judges; (elohim) he shall also bring him to the door, or unto the door post; and his master shall bore his ear through with an aul; and he shall serve him for ever.
The word for judges here is ‘elohiym which is also translated as god. But divine they were not, as I have already shown. They siply represented God in matters in relationship to the law. They came to fail miserably.
Hagin was no man of God but a cheap con artist who conned people with his false teachings.. Presently is under the judgement of God waiting for the final inginity of the lake.That is the facts concerning Hagin. Nothing can change his destiny know. Believing he was anything is a false testimony. This is one confession that will never free him from that place.
You said “Moses was like a god to Israelites according to what God…..” WRONG!!!!
Ex 7: 1 And the LORD said unto Moses, See, I have made thee a god to Pharaoh: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet
Moses was no God to the Israelites but only to appear so to Pharoah.
2 Peter 1: 4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust
When peter said we were partakers of the Divine nature I would have been prudent to check what the word Partaker meant. As it now stands you are looking really silly. The word partaker is the Greek word koinōnos
a partner, associate, comrade, companion
2) a partner, sharer, in anything
This does not mean we become fellow gods. But we are welcomed into fellowship with God. The Holy Spirit works to bring out the fruits of the spirit (Gal 5) There is a massive difference between the nature of God as in his righteousness and holiness and the attributes of God. If you cant tell the difference between the two you really do have a problem.
You obviously don’t understand scripture. To believe yourself a god among many gods make what you believe polytheistic in nature.
Scripture recognises that there are false gods like Baal. That does not mean we are to conclude them to be GODS. They are false gods , just as you are a false god. To set yourself up as a god is to reject what scripture says . There is only ONE GOD. That means Frankie you are not a god!!!!
Luk 17:3 Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.
Luk 17:3 Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.
2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
Jud 1:9 is not saying don’t rebuke, but don’t rebuke falsely. Hagin and co have been well documented . Scripture makes it clear that what they have puched is another gospel. Which is not t5he gospel. Scripture makes it clear about those who come preaching another gospel. Even if it was delivered by a supposed angel.
Frankie if moses was god why then didn’t he get to over the promised land…..Reply: God said he was a god..and you dispute with God’s word,and you want to doubt and question his rationales,and show disrespect to God’s words and on what He had say then and recorded for us now,it was your Unbelief,nothing concern us…Whether Moses manage to get into the promised land,or not,what does that got to do with his position,and who and what he is as described by God then?
Ex 7:1 ..made thee a god to Pharaoh….You showed us all of what God said about Moses as a god to Pharaoh,and yet try to explain that you disbelieve on what God was saying,so what’s your point?
Jesus claimed to be God was being attacked by Pharisee,and so He quote that..in your laws also stated..ye are gods…and it is not wrong to believe we are gods….so what’s your point again?
You keep telling us of your doubts and irrelevance interpretations,digging your heels like a nut,and a denier of God’s words.
I am born again,by the Spirit of God and baptise by water.God’s Spirit live in me.I share God’s divine nature,so I have God’s divine nature in me,so does that not make me divine also?I am born again with a divine nature.So what nature are you born again with?Are you having a satanic nature or human nature,nothing divine at all?
God breathe into me His Spirit,and it enter into my Body and I,my body became a temple of the Holy Spirit.The Bible says I am a god.Satan is a god of this world.I have power over Satan,and have dominion over him,and if I am lesser than a god,how to triumph over him?…Jesus said,ye are gods…I have received after the Holy Ghost came on me,and since you did not received any power and still in darkness,serve you right,you have no part in the Lord”s Kingdom.
Did I become fellow gods?..The Bible declare that I am co-heirs with Christ,sitted with Christ in the heavenlies,and all these terminoogies were used by Paul and he told to us.Since you now dispute Paul’s words,as you show very unskilled in scriptures,almost like a babe–..you on one hands declare that there are false gods…you believe in ONE God,…and you muddied your own understanding by saying Polygamists…so you believe there are false gods being around or pick only one out of the two—there is only One God?
So do you believe in existence there are false gods,or you don’t?..Yes I believe there are false gods around…Peter said we partook God’s divine nature…and you dispute the word”partook””…and as far as terminologies are concern,either we are sharer of God’s divine nature,or companion of God’s nature,or fellowship with God’s nature….if we do not have a divine nature,how to fellowship with God?…..You just hope to dig in your heels to twists the meaning of the scriptures renderings to suit your own mindsets,did you not?
So,YOU CONFESSED THEN,INDIRECTLY,THAT YOU DO NOT HAVE THE NATURE OF GOD,AND WHICH IS DIVINE,AND YOU ONY HAVE HUMAN NATURE WHICH IS EVIL?
yOU ARE TOO SHALLOW,AND TOO STUPID EVEN TO BEGIN A WISE CONVERSATION.
My purpose is to lead you away from strife and bitterness,for anyone who touch the Lord’s anointed it is a sin of death–could it be what John said..the sin that lead to death and we shouldn’t pray for you?…Leave you alone?…My overall intention and motives are pure–to enlighten you guys,but it seems pride and stupidities get hold more of you,and you are bent to be conned by self-righteous Pharisees,and since having anointed by Satan to be another false accusers,against our Word of Faith ministries…..Kenneth Haggin saw Hell,and warned others not to go there.He actually saw the Lord Jesus and in conversation with Him 8 times,either in a vision or in another realms,face to face.
His Rhema Institute is still testifying to the integrity of God’s words,and his teachings were confirmed to be very sound,more sound than all Bible schools of our world combined..
His statements of Faith is clear,and Rhema still abides by it.
His 70 years ministries is a testimony,and countless souls have been added to God’s Kingdom through his messages,and guidance of God’s words,to success and to divine healings.It is hard for you to kick against the Rocks…
Why challenged his teachings,and made yourself stink and smell in the presence of God,and Angels and saints of God in heaven and here on earth?
Not everyone who calls Me Lord Lord shall be saved…Depart from Me,you workers of INIQUITIES….for you hurt my servants,obstruct My cause,…slander and judge my Servants….
Lest happly you were found fighting against God!
Why do you persecute Me?
Leave Rhema’s alone,lest you be seen fighting against God!
Railing accusations,are the kind of Job and Works we must never get into…
Accusing our brethren,this works belong to Satan only..
In the pretext of exposing false teachers,expose false teachings,rebuke openly so that others may learn….WHAT YOU DID WAS ONLY DEFAMING,SLANDERS AND BEARING FALSE WITNESSES,AND TRYING TO RECRUIT ONE BY ONE TO BECOME ANOTHER FALSE WITNESSES AGAINST GOD’S SERVANTS,DOCTRINES AND WORKS OF GOD….YOU WANT TO POISON THE WELLS..AND THAT IS VERY OBVIOUS… THIS IS A FALSE TEACHER’S WORKS IN OUR LAST DAYS TO MAKE YOUNG CHRISTIANS LOSE THEIR ETERNAL LIFE BY GANGING UP, TO HURT THE LORD AND HIS WORKS.
Frankie what I want to know have you parted he Red Sea lately.
Frankie if moses was god then why didnt he get to go over to the promise land? Are you a Big God or a little god?
Ah poor Frankie. Hagins Rhema teachings on his ” rhema word ” is tottaly debunked discredited and if you had any sense you would run from it. Ckeck out my study on it. The Bible clearly disprove Hagins teachings.
SO YOU BELIEVE YOURSELF A god!!!! Now in order to apply for the job of god you need to have certain requirements. How long have you been OMNIPRSENT. If so you should know my address and door number. What am I drinking right now? Simply things but it wil help to see your credientials.
How long have you been OMNICIENT. Which means you should know what I am about to write before I do.
Now the next important piece of information . what have you created recently. Like the odd planet or two. have you been able to resurect a few who were buried for a few weeks. Where where you when Hagin Died . You might have resurected him?
This is probabaly thee most important question to be asked >> when did you die for the sins of the world. That requires that you were born of a virgin, live a sinless life and die on a cross. Have you any recent proof of such an experience.
Now if you fail this simply test then you will have to acknowledge that you are a false god and not worthy of someones worship
It seems pretty clear that you have no regard for scripture . The fact that God himself says that there is only ONE GOD. As you reject this for a multyplicity of gods then it clear you theology is not Bible based. .
AS for hagin seeing hell I agree because that is where he is right now. A sad but permanent reminder of the final judgement to come. Frankie he is there this time for real. As no one was with him when he claimed to visited you have only his word for that. The word of a liar simply does not carry much weight does it. Hagin lied consitiantly and persistanty.
Kenneth Hagin in Word of Faith says, “You are as much the incarnation of God as Jesus Christ was. Every man who has been born again is an incarnation and Christianity is a miracle. The believer is as much an incarnation as was Jesus of Nazareth” (December 1980, p. 14).
Otherwise he claimed to be GOD, not just a God but God himself. Such blasphemy will not go unrewarded. It denies the uniqueness of Jesus.. It elevates man and demeans God. So when the Bible speaks of Jesus being the ONLY BEGOTEN SON OF GOD. That must be rejected as a lie in favour of countless begoten sons . Sorry that will not do. A true christian would search the scriptures for the truth.
As for being saved? Well when you place your faith in your confession and believe you are some sort of Divine being. I seriously doubt. A truth Christian would have an inner desire for the truth. He would search it out and check out the references I have posted. Some of them are now on my SHARING FOLDER. To date you have not bothered to check out the facts. That tells me quite a bit.
NOW THAT yOU HAVE BEEN EXPOSED WE START TO HERE THE SQUEEL THAT YOU ARE BEING PERSECUTED. Excuse me but this is my web site. No one asked you to comment. I am only responding to your posts. The fact is I am trying to wake you up and shake you enough to start thinking about the word of faith being rank heresy.
If Micheal the arch Angel would to make accusation against Satan,a railing accusation against him,Micheal would be really exposing all the evil deeds of Satan for our benefits.But Micheal dare not make railing accusations against Satan!!!!Now for people twice dead,natural brute beasts,that is what Jude calls you guys,clouds without water…once you were saved,now you are doomed,that is why TWICE dead…dare to make accusations against true men of God!!!!!
Turning one by one to become another false accusers,false witnesses,such deceits only a very stubborn and stupid fellow would take the baits…And also,baby Christians could also take the baits….Flee from such pursuits as the Prosecutors Office!….Satan is known as the accuser of our brethren,24/7 making clear case and logical case before God against our brethren….Do you have a logical and reasonable case against your brethren?Join Satan!!!???..I am saying,why be a fool to jump into conclusion and judge another fellow while you yourself cannot interprete scriptures properly?
Poor poor Frankie you are not saying anything!!!! You appear to hate and get angry at anyone who debunks your claims. Have you tried to answer the job description of a god. I doubt it. Untill you can I auggest you go and do some research.
God said to Moses he would appear to be a God to Pharoah. But no where did the Israelites bow down and worship Moses as God. Moses made it clear who sent him and why he was there. It was not that Moses was divine , but that he would only appear as such to pharoah. Pharoah was the one whose heart was hardened against God. Does that not tell you something!!! Be very careful because the man who starts to think of himself as a god is in danger of hardening his heart against the true God. Pharoah also saw himself as a God among many Gods WE all know what happened to him. Many of the emperors of Rome saw themselves as Gods among the many Gods. many of them went insane. There is a judgement against anyone who elevates himself to divinity. Its could be said that many men have elevated themselves and God humbled them. I say this with a sincere warning History makes it clear what happens to those who exalt themselvesas Gods.
Have you tried to answer the job description of a god. I doubt it. Untill you can I auggest you go and do some research….Reply: Whether Israelites or any one worship Moses s god,is not the concern or matter.It is God who said that Moses is a god,and that settles it.Whether who elevate who and what elevate what,is not any issue.I do not need to suggest anything.The Lord already said it.So what’s your beef again?
U: WE all know what happened to him. Many of the emperors of Rome saw themselves as Gods among the many Gods. many of them went insane.
Reply: Who went insane or not insane doesn’t invalidate God’s word which He said Moses is a god,and the Bible says Satan is the god of this world,and Jesus reasoned,””ye are gods””.
FRANKIE YOU HAVE NOT TRIED TO ANSWER ANYTHING LEAST OF ALL WHAT HAS BEEN POSTED. Like all word of faith believers you rip verses out of context to the exclusion of context meaning or anything else. Gods judgement on those who claim to be God is very important. Have you answered the job description yet. If so do you seriously believe that you qualify . I doubt it. Men have gone insane because the judgement of GOD came upon them. Again Moses was only to appear as a god to one man Pharoah. Not because he was aGod but because that is how pharoah saw him. Most certainly Moses brethren never mistook him for some deity.
Before I will allow you to chump your lips further , let us look at https://www.box.com/s/y7yhmdpq0neu2qq08cl0 The FINAL EXPOSURE OF THE RHEMA WORD
This proves without doubt that Hagins flag ship doctrine was a LIE . As I suspect you are unwilling and probabaly incapable of reading it out of fear.
Please answer to see if you fit the jobs description of someone who is a GOD. Do you refer to yourself as Yawah ot Jehovah?. Do you have any references from the archangel Gabrial, or even Michael to back up your claim? What about a CV giving details of any past experiences as a God. Job oppertunities and such like. Any ground breaking miracles and death defeating miracles that has made its way into the press or the news? Say the creation of a small moon even , verified by Nassa of course.
My My frankie the god father hagin is deader than a doornail. Remember when father hagin would sneese the
ramnites thought that god had sneesed. The Most resent man god that had died is son yun moon. He was a self procaimed god who claimed he too was god. But unfortunately like father Hagen he too according to the scriptures is where all the heritics wind up. wake up.
Let me prove to you that you are unclean,dirty and foul mouths and confirmed to be a slanderer.
U wrote: The Most resent man god that had died is son yun moon. He was a self procaimed god who claimed he too was god. But unfortunately like father Hagen he too according to the scriptures is where all the heritics wind up. wake up.
Reply: You cannot see the difference,between Moon and Hagin ,so you having no sense of simple distinguishing skills and senses,are you not dead in conscience?
son yun moon claimed to be god?…You are the most dumbest nut i have ever seen….Jesus says ye are gods…and He meant all His children are gods,and no one is exception,or just fitting for Hagin only….You try to make Hagin as exclusive,and Hagin alwasy said we are all God’s children,and we who are born again,partaook God divine nature…AND HAGIN IS NOT EXCLUSIVE.How come you just follow blindly what those Idiot Theologians told you?…You are another fellow who… ever learning but never come to knowledge!!
what is really sad their dogma is Jesus was a total man but they do not acknowlage the incarnation according to John. His name is imanuel god with us. The angels worshiped him as a babe in the manger. But they do acknowledge that we are gods and on the same level as god. THE BIBLE SAYS Gods wisdom is as far as the heaven is above earth. They taught that you couldnt even question what the leadership was saying. Our pastor was a x Jahovah witness and a bouncer so you had to pay attension or he might bounce you right out of the service. The week before we left his son-n-law and him got into two fist fights in front of church.
He was very controlling and when I questioned him on what he taught he always got mad and usually hang up. I was hindered greatly in that church and if you didnt agree with what he taught it was curtains. I do love him like I love you frankie but you must believe the scripture is spiritual and if you are carnal minded you wont fully understand it. I want to thank Pastor John and UC for this web sight. It has ment so much to me during this time of change.
Here is UC ministries trying to turn you into another false witnesses,mislead you to hurt God’s honored men of God.The whole motive is to poison the well,cause strifes and hatred,and you just took the bait!Pastor John and UC are not blessing you anything but lies and distortion.When you chose to bad mouth another fellow brethren,you sinned.
Hagin died claiming her was yawah. Sun Moon die claiming he was a God. Both have since gone to hell. End of debate Your arguements are irelavant as you are not prepared to look at the evidence. Any true Bible believing Christian would be horified at the quote Hagin gave of himself.. You want to be yawah Go ahead. But by claiming divinity to yourself and you will be judged as a idol. All idols will be cut down. You may worship hagin as a Yawah. But I see him for what he was. At the end the man was given over to the unholy spirit that conbtrolled him . .
56.Hagin died claiming her was yawah. Sun Moon die claiming he was a God.
Reply: Again you want to bear false witness.Since when did Hagin claiming to be God?If Hagin claiming to be God,do you mean I would follow him?Try claiming God in our days,or the days in Hagin.No ministries will ever survive on that false claims!You do not even need to attack or expose!
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Both have since gone to hell.
Reply: Did Hagin went to Hell?..Hagin believed and accept Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour,repented from all his sins,serve God with distinction and integrity for 70 years,honored by Christendom,and we are all still agreeing and standing with him,and believing his doctrines as accurate and sound.
Kenneth Hagin warned people of Hell fires,as the Lord Jesus appeared to him and told him to warn others of the place Hell fires.
Hagin told the Lord Jesus to provide Scriptures on certain revelations,during Jesus visits to him,and Hagin honors the Holy Bible with the greatest fervor than all men I knew.
Hagin believes that the blood of Jesus Christ washes away all our sins,and that Jesus died for him,and went to Hell for him,and Hagin loves Jesus,by his action and deeds,and we are all witnesses.Since you judge that Hagin,a known believer of Jesus Christ,who had the blood of Jesus to cover for him,and had repented all of his sins went to Hell,then,what about you who slander and foul mouth and cause people to bear false witness,would you go to Heaven then?
John Edward 14 year old daughter died..and is it true that bitterness eat you up?You show yourself as one failing to appropriate God’s promises,fail to receive God’s blessings,so you hate Faith Word movement,is that not correct?
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End of debate Your arguements are irelavant as you are not prepared to look at the evidence. Any true Bible believing Christian would be horified at the quote Hagin gave of himself.. You want to be yawah Go ahead. But by claiming divinity to yourself and you will be judged as a idol. All idols will be cut down. You may worship hagin as a Yawah. But I see him for what he was. At the end the man was given over to the unholy spirit that conbtrolled him . .
Comment by UC MINISTRIES | October 20, 2012 | Reply
Reply:: Peter told me that I partook God divine nature,or you said that I shared God’s divine nature,because you said”partook”meant “”shared…”””…which is the same thing,right?…Peter said that I partook God’s nature…but you dispute what Peter wrote,and accuse indirectly that Peter wrote the false words…and since you are no believer of the Bible,why show us the Bible teachings?…Jesus claimed to be of Divine origin,so would He judge as a Idol?…We didn’t claim to be of Divine origin,in the same sense like Jesus who was pre-existed.
We became sons of God,and born again when we come to Lord JEsus,and our divinity begins from then.Our support of scriptures is this: But as many as received Him to them gave He POWER to become children of God…We have received the Power to become sons of God,but you have it before and now lose it,is it not right?
Are you SUBJECT to the Lord God Almighty? The devil told Adam and Eve they would become as gods. The desire to be “a god” in and of one’s self… to make one’s self the equal of the Lord God Almighty is of the devil and is the rebellion of satan.
You argue for “who you are” as “a god”. Well, so argues the devil himself. Satan declares himself to be “a god” who is not subject to God but is “a god” in and of himself.
You generate a gospel in which you say that this rebellion of Lucifer to become the devil is what Jesus Christ came to “establish” and “make alright” through His death on a cross.
The Word of Faith so corrupts scripture… that they have in their own minds turned Jesus Christ into Satan telling them He died so that they could become devils approved by God declaring themselves to be “a god” in rebellion against God…a nd “this is the gospel”.
Word of Faith people are possessed by the devil… trying to create a gospel in which Jesus Christ now takes the place of Satan in the Garden of Eden… telling everyone He died so that they could be devils as “gods” in rebellion against God.
I think it is of the devil for you to tell us you are “a god” and Jesus died to make you “a god”. Your “Jesus” is the devil himself twisting the scripture and turning the cross upside down… turning Jesus Christ into the devil who tempted men saying they could be “as gods”.
Rather than telling us all that this “Jesus” is the “real Jesus” and this “gospel” is the “real gospel”.. and you are “a god” and this “Jesus” made you such… why don’t you prove yourself to be a Christian rather than a man possessed by satan… and tell us that you are a miserable sinner saved by grace alone, a created being, and it is your heart’s desire to submit yourself to God, worship Him alone… and thank Him every day for saving you from your many, many sins.
Why don’t you preach that God alone is God and He alone is worthy to be worshipped and praised… and that man is a sinner dead in sins and trespasses who has no hope but grace in his miserable state.
And why don’t you tell us that there is no power but the blood of Jesus Christ to save us from our many, many sins and the desperate wickedness of our hearts as sinners.
Why don’t you preach the cross of Jesus and call men to their knees before God in honor of Him as the only True God who alone is to be worshipped??
The greatest gift is love we must strive for it and love one another like Jesus did on the cross we still have our own free will and can choose to believe what we want as long as as it lines up with the bible that is the bueatiful thing about God. That is the real gift God has given us chose.
One of the major problems that word of faith believers have to cope with is the need to keep telling themselves they are a God. That means having to try and live up to an elevated level of a god. Whose heights are so high and the air so thin that they almost fall over with the shear magnitude of their boasting. But when a person keeps getting told that like God he is a god. But even more so that they too are the same
INCARNATION OF God as JESUS was . That when Jesus says he was the I AM they can boast they too are the I AM. Never mind the fact that God himself says he will not share that glory.
He can do what God does, he can create as God does. He can manifest the same faith as God does. Such positive thinking then becomes an heavy opium that few can resist. Stinking PRIDE fills these people to the point that other lowly people who have not grasp the revelation of their godhood are beneath them. If they cant see their own personal godhood then tough luck. They have arrived at a place where even God has to submit himself to them. The high priest who must keep what they confess.
They are above every other creature towering as gods among men, little realising that Satan boasted the very same thing. They see themselves as rich wealthy and success fills their vision. But God sees them as they truly are POOR WRETCHED AND BLIND.
God has his own way of humbling such gods. As history records ever tyrant and demi god have been laid low. Their idols crushed beneath his feet. .
Frankie is just another poor demi god with aspirations of divinity, yet he is unable to offer up a single explanation of his divinity. Not one attribute that we could behold . Not one vestige that would allow men to bow and worship him. Hagin death was not just remarkable but a divine hand of judgement .
He claims to be the same incarnation as Jesus was.
Jesus was worshipped by angels>>>> Did hagin believe he too should be worship by angels?
Jesus had no beginning >>>> Hagin had a beginning
Jesus has no end of days >>>> Hagin died
Jesus was creator and sustainer of the universe>>>> Hagin could not even sustain his own life ,
Jesus was the only Begotten Son >>>> Hagin life was anything but unique.
Jesus had no sin >>>> Hagin was born and shapen in iniquity
Jesus remains our great high priests. Hagin cant even fulfil that job requirement,
Jesus is our judge >>>>> Hagin was judged
Jesus gives life >>>> Hagin had no life to give He died
Jesus rose from the dead >>>> Hagin bones remain in his coffin.
Jesus sent the Holy Spirit >>>> Hagin too late the Holy Spirit has already come
Holy spirit will reveal Jesus >>>> He did not come to reveal Hagin
Holy Spirit leads to the truth >>> Hagin followed the father of lies.
Holy Spirit motivates people to realise their sin and repent from it. >>> How can Hagin be a God when he was born a sinner.
God exists from eternity to eternity >>>> God was not made but exist outside of time. Hagin died period His time was up.
So when Hagin says he was as much an incarnation of God as Jesus was, he was talking like a fool and LIED to his own destruction.
Frankie you seem to be incapable of understand the difference between Gods nature .>> Holy righteous and pure, and the attributes of God. Gal speaks about the fruits of the spirit. Love Joy Peace patience goodnbess Etc. They are not the attributes of a God. Omnipresence, omnicience and being all powerful.
But Just keep talling yourself you are and God will wipe the floor with you.
He [Jesus] tasted spiritual death for every man. And His spirit and inner man went to hell in my place. Can’t you see that? Physical death wouldn’t remove your sins. He’s tasted death for every man. He’s talking about tasting spiritual death.” (Ken Hagin, “How Jesus Obtained His Name.”)
Heresy!!!! Jesus did not die spiritually. Hagins rejction of the cross as the basis for the atonement makes him a heretic. Physical death was all that was required.
The trouble with us is that we’ve preached a ‘cross’ religion, and we need to preach a ‘throne’ religion. By that I mean that people have thought they were supposed to remain at the cross. Some have received the baptism in the Holy Spirit, have backed up to the cross, and have stayed there ever since…The cross is actually a place of defeat, whereas the Resurrection is a place of triumph. When you preach the cross, you’re preaching death, and you leave people in death.” (Ken Hagin, “The Believer’s Authority,” page 16. Second Edition 1986)
Christ’s physical death on the cross was not enough to save us. (Kenneth Hagin, How Jesus obtained His Name, Tape 44H01)
Since when was the cross a place of defeat. Its the very opposite he was the greatest victory that man has ever seen. Hagins lies condemned him as a heretic.
1Cr 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
The demonstration of the power of God is not a defeat but a victory
Gal 6:14 But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
Why glory is something that was a defeat. The corss was a glorious victory. Jesus was never defeated Once.
Frankie The things that makes us different from Christ is is that he is truly the only beggotten Son of God. He is the first Born . But we are adopted into the familyof God .He did not sin and he was born not the same way we were. We were born into sin he wasnt. The womb that was prepaired for him was a virgin. Spotless and pure just like him. He is the word of God and created the unverse. He is the second person of the trinity and we are partakers of his divine nature but that doesnt make us divine. He is on the right side of the father interceeding for us He still sets the captive free. He never sinned but he bore our sins on the cross. Our life starts at the cross and begins there not in hell. To say he spent three days in hell the region of the damned make God the father a unjust god. Frankie you sound like a broken record just like hagin who spawned all of these word of faith prospery preachers on t.v. To deny Jesus divinity is to make him less than he is. But it doesnt stop there because this is only the tip of the ice berg. Out of this one doctrine has spawned many more false doctrines. The reason why we are upset because it has truly pentitrated the church like the trojen house. And buy the way I do have my own mind unlkike you who let every perverted person of the gospell controll yours. Instead of Christ people are trustin in their faith. I
Dear Tracy,Every intention here of mine is to share the words of God,rightly interpreted the words of God,and lead you to the light and truths.I am imploring you guys not to become another slanderers,another false witneses,or else you guys inadvertently offended the Lord,sinned,and forfeited the Eternal life which was once yours.In today’s world,false teachers” people like Apologetics Index ministries,Berean,Let Us reason Ministries,CRI,Mccdonnel,Dave Hunt,John Macarthur….and many others deliberately made attacks at successful men and women of God,write and preach bad things about them.Even John Piper,Paul Washer…they seem do sound,but also very imperfect in their messages,and attacks againts our fellow brethren.
Due to Ministry rivlaries,and the sins of envies entered our hearts,…since when did Satan go for holiday,and stop hating us,and seen not hindering the works of God all across the world?
Please repent of your sins,for your ignorance of the truths will also lead you to doom.You are supposd to know that to bear false witness is a terrible sinned,and it is compounded if you hurt real and true servants of God.
People who are ignorance,and jump into wrong conclusion about someone,so inadvertently hurt them,thinking they are truly doing for God’s words,were sent to Hell,how much more we who were commanded to love our brethen and never to bear false witness?
Someone else evil agendas are theirs,why agree with them and get into challenging the doctrines of good men of God in whom we had affirmed as true, honest and were sound?
Christ is different from us,and He is the only begotten of God the Father,are the same beliefs we all held,preach and teach.Implying that we believe otherwise,it is slanders,and bearing false witness,and if more people think we are such who hold onto false doctrines,wouldn’t they condemn us also?….Since the Kingdom of God allows us to repent and move on,daily and we can come to His throne for mercies..let’s say,if we happen to mis-spoke or errs in the past,and we are forgiven now,so why must Satan inspired people to judge us and condemn us again be accepted again?
Yesterday I may interprete the scriptures erroneously,and in Charismatic world,if we errs,we repent just like any believers,and we don’t stop there and stays there.But you people stays there,work on it,and 24/7 make accusation before God with Satan guiding you guys….You mean that you know what happen today of any believers,whether they have repent or not,or have repented of false doctrines if they have?…
As Christian we partake His divine nature,and if we are not divine,then we may as well don’t partake His nature?If we are born again with the water and the Spirit of God,and we received powers after the Holy Ghost come upon us,and if we are the temple of God,and we are new creation,as became God’s children…does it not make us divine exactly?….Do you mean you alwasy have the Old man,and you did not have the New man?You were not make new yet?I urge you to repent and accept Jesus as Lord and Saviour,and believe what Paul the Apostle teach also…He that believe in Me,out of the belly shall flows rivers of living waters…wow,is that not a divine person?…Jesus co9mmanded us to cast our devils,heal the sick,..speak in tongues…gave us power over all teh the powers of our enemies..over scopion and snakes…does that not make us divine?……To errs is human,to forgive—divine…are we not divine for we forgive others and even love our enemies!
Did Jesus spent three days in Hell?Tell me which denomination..even John Mac,the most Fundamentalists believers..the Apostle Creed…and everyone in Christendom believe that Jesus went to Hell for 3 days…so are you are cult?..Out of your follies spin many false allegation and charges against us…
In the pretext of trying to expose the dark deeds of the Charismatic Christian,these are the people which are truly false prophets,false teachers,and their purpose is to mislead,is to be self righteous,to be Pharisees,is to judge and condemn us,and also try to make others lose Eternal life as they also judge and condemn and bear false witness.—and jump into wrong conclusion….Jesus taught us to leave false ministries alone,and we just do our works of evangelisms…and Charismatic did that,leave all those false accusers alone to face their own doom,shake their dust out from them…..BUT I CHOSE TO LEAD YOU PEOPLE OUT OF DARKNESS AND TRY TO SAVE YOUR SOULS.Telling you never to be another slanderer,another accusers of our brethren…..
You are upset because false doctrines enter our Church?…Who isn’t?Saul persecuted Christians also,and even when the Lord Jesus appeared and talk to Him,he cannot recognised Him at all!!!…If you are upset,you preach the Correct doctrines,and leave others alone….
Did Hagin Deny Jesus divinity?….You are insulting our IQ,or it is you who had a very low IQ,very little minds of your own,and you actually believe such LIES?????…If we believe we partook God’s nature,born again,and is now divine,how can we ever deny Jesus as Divine?
Your nature and minds are so corrupted….You lost every faculty to reasons…..I can see that you were deceived to a high degree.
If your brother fall,we believe in restoration,unlike you guys who believe in Judgment and Condemnation,…like Billy Graham,he went to counsel Mormon Romney,and can Billy Graham be wrong to try to save this Mormon?—.Jame Baker did very bad for the Lord then,and Billy didn’t condemn him and even went to restore him back,and no bad words were heard from Billy…….Did you know we believe in sanctification?….Let’s say Benny Hinn made a mistake,and he curse others for attacking his ministries…20 years ago,he already repented of this sin.Today,are we to rake out his past and attack him of his follies now?
Let’s say Benny Hinn smoke drugs.Can we attack him for using drugs?…Benny Hinn already repent then,and the blood of Jesus cleanse him,so if today you attack him,are you not “”despising the blood of Jesus””and the works of God in his life today?…We overcome Satan by our wrds of testimony and by the blood of the Lam,Jesus Christ.We plead for cover and cleansing,and if you can rake up the past to make us guilty,you may as well be a heathen!..Which part of our Faith,the mostly high value of loving our brethre,you cannot understand?
He that hate his brother abide in death..
This need to be seen as a god is a matter of stinking pride. Nothing more. When a man elevates himself he touches on Gods glory. You dont touch what God will not share. As ps 82 says you will die. Then the judgement Hagin elevated himself at the cost of demeaning God. By declaring himself the same INCARNATION as Jesus was, he was to all intent and purposes adding himself to the trinity . FATHER , SON , THE HOLY SPIRIT AND POOR KENNETH HAGIN.. Thats just blasphemy. But those are the ramifications of proclaiming oneself the incarnation of God. Hagin is paying for it now. Dont be so foolish to head down the same road
As for the three days Jesus spent in hell . That was a preaching engagement. He certainly was not there atoning for sins , nor was he even suffering under the heel of some demon or other. That came out of Hagins immagination .
1Pe 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
Luk 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.
Jesus made it clear THAT DAY he would take the repent thief to paradise . Now unless you believe paradise is hell I suggest this debunks Hagin theories.
Further more when Jesus decalred that IT IS FINISHED, The atonement was finished complete and accepted. There was no need to further atone for sins in some dark regions of hell. More Hagin new age Lies. Cross was a victory. One of which you obviously disagree with.
The major problem with the word of faith is pure unadultery stinking pride. They land up being so duped by satan on some ego trip, that they just cant see just how bound up they are. They are so High on positive thinking that they loose sight of the truth. That is if they every had it to start wih. Frankie be there done it and bought the tee shirt. You are into witchcraft. But stay on the road you are on and one way or another all will become clear. As for trying to get people into your heresy haahahaahahahahahahaha NO CHANCE .
U said: You are into witchcraft.
Reply: See,you have another accusation that I am into witchcraft,and you cannot prove anything about it!These false accusation and bearing of false witness of mine is enough you to be removed from God’s kingdom,and who cannot see that bearing false witnesses would have your names erase from the Lamb book of life?
You: Further more when esus decalred that IT IS FINISHED, The atonement was finished complete and accepted.
Reply: So I agree with you on this statments,so all all my Faith- word people,also base on these words,are we then also true servants of God,right?….Do we not also accept that Jesus declared it is finished,so the atonement is finished?Yes it is…..Can we not also said,though it sound Thelogically incorrect,…later on Jesus needed to go to Heaven,to do the works of the Spiritual Tabernacle…that is why He said to Mary “”docn’t touch Me,for I have yet ascended to Heaven..later one they can touch Him”….After Jesus said it is finished,he still went to Hell,and for 3 days over there,doing many works…and Jesus also led a procession showing that Satan and the DEmons werew defeated by Him?…..And then Jesus is still doing Intercession for us…and why He prayed for us if the works is completed???
You: There was no need to furter atone for sins in some dark regions of hell.
Reply: By implying to say we preach that Jesus to further atone for our sins in dark region of Hell,this is a lie,and a sheer slanders again…
U: As for the three days Jesus spent in hell . that was a preaching engagement. He certainly was not there atoning for sins , nor was he even suffering under the heel of some demon or other. That came out of Hagins immagination .
Reply: So you believe that Jesus went to Hell for 3 days?Or did you not believe Jesus went to Hell?
Jesus suffered under the hands of Pontius Pilate,Pharisees,and demons attacked Jesus-tempted Him…or should I say Demons inspired people to torment Jesus…or demons torment Jesus..all were accurate depiction and reasonable accounts in English Language accounts.There is nothing in these terms to suggest one is deceived by such words of description,ever!!!
ONLY AN IDIOT WOULD USE SUCH THINGS TO DECLARE WE ARE FALSE TEACHERS!
To say that Jesus did not suffer under the hands of Satan,tormented by demons,suffered under men,then,that is a LIE.
Those who say that Jesus did not suffer for our sins,that is a lie from Hell.Jesus did suffer for our sins,under evil spirits,people….Although no one seem to have accurate information on what actually Jesus did in Hell,in an compartment known as Paradise, for the past 3 days,..but we know He went to lead captives free over there.
2 Peter 2
“1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves. 2 Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. 3 In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up…
Short but very good . Take heed to what these men are saying Frankie for your own sake. Because what these Word of Faith teachers are teaching is rank stinking heresy. No good will come from it and never has.
FRANKIE YOU ARE TRYING TO ASK QUESTIONS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN ANSWERED IN GREAT DETAIL. YOU CANT EVEN REFUTE WHAT HAS ALREADY BEEN POSTED. YOU HAVE NO REAL INTENTION OF CHECKING OUT WHAT HAS BEEN POSTED.
I ISUGGEST YOU FIND SOME OTHER PLACE TO GRIP AND MOAN. YOU HAVE A SERIOUS ISSUE I SUGGEST RATHER THAN TRYING TO CONFESS YOUR WAY OUT OF IT. GO TO JESUS AND ASK HIM TO OPEN YOUR EYES , GIVE YOU ARE HEARING HEART .
HUMBLE YOURSELF AND REPENT OF THE WHOLE YOU ARE A GOD THING, BECAUSE SERIOUSLY YOU ARE GOING TO BE IN THE SOUP. YOU’RE TOUCHING GODS GLORY. AT THE COST OF ELEVATING YOURSELF YOU ARE DEMEANING GOD.
Christ’s physical death on the cross was not enough to save us. (Kenneth Hagin, How Jesus obtained His Name, Tape 44H01)
“Why did He need to be begotten or born? Because He became like we were – separated from God. Because He tasted spiritual death for every man. And His spirit and inner men went to hell in my place. Can’t you see that? Physical death wouldn’t remove your sins. He’s tasted death for every man. He’s talking about tasting spiritual death. Jesus is the first person that was ever born again. Why did His spirit need to be born again? Because it was estranged from God.” (Kenneth Hagin, “How Jesus obtained His Name” (Kenneth Hagin Ministries, audio tape #44-H01)
Both are heretical statements!! that means Hagin was a false teacher. If he was a false teacher then everyone who follows him is a false believer. This is another Jsus and another gospel. So frankie stop talling porkies. Your hatred for some of the nicest and godliest people in Christendom is remarkable, Not very positive in your confessions are you!!!!
Jesus said that he himself was separated from God then.Hagin also said that,and agree with Jesus.Since you silly fellows hated the scriptures,by making a verdict and judgment call,explicitly stated that Hagin is in heretic,a false teacher—who cannot see it is actually you guys who are truly false prophets,disguised as Angels of Light,hoping to poison us,and cause divisions and cause..incite.. self-righteous anger againsts us,and also recruit others to bear false witnesses also!….
Since you guys hated the Bible doctrines so much…and John Edwards told us of the death of his 14 year old child,how deep is his bitterness against Word of Fath?…You cannot can get your daughter healed,and you went through trials of fires,we understand..but God cannot be mock and He must be worship…The Demons destroyed your child,told you to hate Word Fath movement and Hagin,inject poisons into your veins,and you oblige?????
It seems now we are getting to the true nature of Frankie. The one that hates all truth. Despises it with a passion. Thank you for revealing yourself as you trully are. Knowing the spirit behind the word of faith I was correct.. Your ranting and raving is exposing you far more than I need too. Had you listen to the video by Justin Peters the subject about Jesus suppose seperation would have been answered. But then your just too afarid. That sadly is where all this heresy takes you . Binds you up with fear anger and supsertition. Had Jesus ceased to be the pure sinless son of God there could be no sacrifice. The sin ofering had to be pure before during and afterwards. Jesus never ceased to be God. His suffering was in his flesh. The fleshly atoement was all that was needed. The lies of the Word of faith as simply new age hersies. Your are a poor man Frankie and your hatred is simply oooozzzing out of you.
Yes Hagin and the Word of faith is heresy to core. Men who have given themselves over to another spirit, another gospel that cannot save and will not save. God loves you and he can heal you of all that hatred if you will allow him. He is truly God and your NOT.
67.It seems now we are getting to the true nature of Frankie. The one that hates all truth. Despises it with a passion.
Frankie/Me: Lord Jesus is the Truth,and as I am His,so I make my points from the platform of Truths,and origins of Truths.
Now I prove to you again that I always despise lies,and honors truths and righteousness.I declare to all,that Lord Jesus is the truth,come and believe in Him,repent of your sins of pride and slanders,and you can find mercies from Him.Lord Jesus loves you.Don’t be another recruits of bearer of false witnesses,nor getting involved in slanders.
No slanderers shall inherit the Kingdom of God.
I have shown my passion and my true nature.This is what I preach and teach.
***
Thank you for revealing yourself as you trully are.
Me:Now I reveal to all of what I believe,in those words,and everybody can judge and see if they are correct and sound.Now I have shown all.
If you set yourself at variance again as to what I had revealed in those words,then you are taking the position of my enemies,and you oppose the truths of the teachings and Faith I have in the Saviour of my Lord Jesus.
———————-
Knowing the spirit behind the word of faith I was correct.. Your ranting and raving is exposing you far more than I need too.
Me: My rantings and ravings so adamentally that Jesus is the Saviour and He died for my sins,and the same major doctrines Hagin also shared and agree with me,that Lord Jesus went to Hell,died physically and spiritually for our Salvation,and Jesus is coming soon,and there is a Hell and Heaven of which we teach so passionately–it really shown our colors isn’t it?
So what are your colors?..Hoping to bear false witness.Tell lies.Make acusation like Satan,and you took the office of Satan,and assumed his role as another accusation of our brethren,and you forfeit your own Righteousness in exchange of hurting God’s works and God’s servants.
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Had you listen to the video by Justin Peters the subject about Jesus suppose seperation would have been answered. But then your just too afarid.
Reply: Justin Peters most likely will slither like a snake and manisfest demonic possession if he were to walk into our presence.We would be likely casting out demons from his body,and showered great love for him,correct him and bless him,if he should come into our meetings.
To say that Jesus was not separated from God the Father,that is direct opposition of the exclamation Jesus cried: My God my God,why have you forsaken me?….Are you saying the 4 gospel accounts of Jesus,and on this aspect,are not true accounts?….Question; Did God leave Jesus alone for a while then?
Was Jesus separated from God then?…
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That sadly is where all this heresy takes you . Binds you up with fear anger and supsertition. Had Jesus ceased to be the pure sinless son of God there could be no sacrifice.
Reply: You mean to tell me everyone in the Faith movements does not know and affirmed that,had Jesus ceased to be pure and sinless (son of God-)son of MAN,there could be no sacrifice?WHEN THE LORD JESUS TOOK OUR SINS,AND IT IS THERE THAT RANSOM WAS PAID,IT DOES NOT MEAN THAT JESUS COMMITTED SINS,AND THEREFORE HIS SACRIFICE CANNOT BE ACCEPTED.THIS KIND OF EVIL SURMISINGS AND DISTORTIONS,ONLY SATAN CAN THINK OF IT….IT IS EXTREMELY OBNOXIOUS AND DEMONIC TO SUGGEST THAT WE EXPLAINED THAT JESUS WAS UNCLEAN AND SO HIS SACRIFICE COULD NOT BE ACCEPTED BY GOD…..It is still perfectly theologically correct to say that Jesus took our sins on the cross—and it is evil insinuations to suggest that we suppose Jesus is not sinless when he offered Himself as a sacrifice…..Paul said we are crucified with Christ…using such terminology was not wrong,so how wrong can we be?
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The sin ofering had to be pure before during and afterwards. Jesus never ceased to be God.
Reply: God had become a man,and ceases to be God.Jesus was a man,and the Bible says that God became a man and ceases to become God,for He,who is God left His powers and set aside His status and Being as God.Jesus was 100% human.
The Bible teaches that God become man.Jesus was restored to His original position after His death,and resurrection.Everyone can see that Jesus was a man,and even the powers He used were from God the Holy Spirit,working through Him….NOW WHICH PART YOU ARE BLURRRRRRED….AGAIN?
His suffering was in his flesh. The fleshly atoement was all that was needed. The lies of the Word of faith as simply new age hersies. Your are a poor man Frankie and your hatred is simply oooozzzing out of your.
Yes hagin and the Word of faith is heresy to core. men who have given themselvesover to another spirit, another gospel that cannt save and will not save. God loves you and he can heal ou of all that hatred if you will allow him. He is truly God and your NOT.
It looks like I am not the only one that realises the dangers of the Word of faith teachings. This comment comes from http://watchmanforjesus.blogspot.co.uk/2010/02/truth-and-danger-about-word-faith.html
Its well worth reading the rest of the article to get the whole
“Faith in Doctrines of Demons (1 Timothy 4:1-5) leads to Fear and Death!
Guilt is generally brought about by the tension generated when one was positively confessing but getting no results. According to the Word-Faith position, no results equals lack of faith or open sin in one’s life. This can, and usually does, cause excessive introspection and a tremendous guilt feelings. Sometimes the guilt is real and needs to be dealt with, but often there is no reason for the feelings. Whatever the person was positively confessing was not in God’s plan and He is not going to bring it about.
Fear comes from two areas. First is the obsessive compulsion to be positive in every word. Even using phrases such as “I’m just dying to do that” or “that joke just tickled me to death,” release satanic powers, say the Word-Faith teachers (The Tongue – A Creative Force, p. 90-92). People become afraid that they are going to slip up, utter a negative word, and give a place to Satan. Secondly, fear is a corollary to the guilt mentioned above. Fear and guilt usually work in a downward spiral. One feels guilty because of supposed lack of faith, then afraid because the confession is not “working.” Then there is more guilt, then more fear, and so on down into further despair. This cycle can be extremely spiritually and physically debilitating. All of these spiritual and psychological difficulties can be directly attributed to elevating man to the false position of being a god and saying that he has powers far greater than he really does.
How should the church respond?
We have seen enough evidence to conclude that the Word-Faith message is a dangerous soul-destroying heresy that simply does not work. It is a body of presumptuous teachings that lacks the authority of the Word of God. It is a system of thinking that has been generated by a group of men drawing from each other’s teachings with an amalgamation of Christian theology, mysticism and Gnosticism bound together by one of the most fanciful methods of Scripture interpretation ever devised. All of this is buttressed by a mutual admiration society among the most popular of the Word-Faith teachers that admonishes critics to “touch not the Lord’s anointed,” often under dire threats of divine displeasure.
The Word-Faith movement has done more than its share of producing strife in the body of Christ. Scores of well-meaning Christians are in bondage to this unscriptural philosophy. The results of the Word-Faith teachings is to leave many people full of confusion, guilt and fear – the very things that the Word-Faith movement professes to eradicate.
The time is long due for Christians to take a serious look at the teachings”
THE DANGERS OF THESE TEACHINGS ARE REAL. MAKE NO MISTAKE ABOUT IT. DEATHS HAVE OCCURED WHEN PEOPLE HAVE TRIED TO TAKE THIS TEACHING TO ITS ULTIMATE CONCLUTION. FRANKIE OTHERS HAVE BEEN WHERE YOU HAVE BEEN AND SEEN THE DANGERS AND RAN FROM IT. THEY DID NOT LOOSE THEIR SANITY, THEY FOUND IT . WHEN MEN BUILD ON SAND ENEVITABLE THEY WILL SINK. THAT IS WHERE THE WORD OF FAITH TEACHINGS WILL TAKE YOU.
This can, and usually does, cause excessive introspection and a tremendous guilt feelings. Sometimes the guilt is real and needs to be dealt with, but often there is no reason for the feelings. Whatever the person was positively confessing was not in God’s plan and He is not going to bring it about.
Reply: This is just an opinion.
Again,accusing us of causing people to fear and guilt?…..
U: People become afraid that they are going to slip up, utter a negative word, and give a place to Satan.
Me: So are you to embolden people to not account of their words?Jesus taught that every word shall be held accountable in the day of Judgment,so Jesus was wrong to have taught all these words because people become afraid that they are going to slip…afraid..causing people to afraid and guilt..?????I believe what Jesus taught was not wrong,and we should heed the words of Jesus…and also we must heed the conviction of sins in our hearts,by GOD,
which made us feel guilty if we have sins,so that we may know and repent and change!!!Have you not read that the Spirit of God convicts man of sins,of righteousness and judgment?…In the days of Charles Finney,people were felt so guilty that they repent of their sins,Bars and Theatres were closed,and they all run to God for mercies and salvation…
***Am I not writing to dumb,and stupid people here?
Your problem Frankie is that you agree with the heretics, which makes you one as well. Because you are also blind you are not even prepared to look at the evidence which explains things in some detail. Thats called FEAR in anyones book. That is where this teaching is going to take you. Psychological you will become bound with Fear self hatred and confusion. Simply put the word of faith teachings dont work. It appears to work for those who preach it because people are guliable to send these con men money and more money. Thats how they get rich. But they do it at your expense. The poor guliable people never get rich, They buy the tapes , the books , the vidos and tithe, but they remain poor.
Frankie you say : “God had become a man,and ceases to be God Bible says that God became a man and ceases to become God”
Do you seriously realise how stupid that is
Jhn 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Had Jesus cease to be God then God himself ceases . The term is immutability, otherwise God can and will never change. Doctrine of demons is all that the wiord of faith teachers hold up.
Mal 3:6 For I [am] the LORD, I change not; therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.
The God that the WOF teahers hold to is not the God of the Bible , but something they have immagined.
Had Jesus cease to be God then God himself ceases . The term is immutability, otherwise God can and will never change. ….
Reply: Jesus was seen to be a man.He walked,eat and sleep.I know God cannot be approached because He is very glorious person,and even Moses only had seen His back,so it was told to us….If you do not believe Jesus then was a man,a sinless man,and God did not become a man,then you erred.God became a man doesn’t mean His originality as God was invalidated.If God took the human form,can we say He was still God then?
It is correct to say that God is unchanging,or immutable,or the same yesterday,today and forever…but it is also theologically correct to say that Jesus was a Son of man,although he is also known as the Son of God.If God become man,then God become man.It is being nasty and stupid to attack us as though we erred in our teachings..
No this is not an opinion because others have been there done it and sold the tee shirt. We know exaclty where you are going and what is going to happen. The theology is a lie and the Wof confessions dont work. An allusion people create around themselves. When reality eventually breaks through OH boy it hurts.. You will be left sitting with a book shelf of books and tapes and none of them will be worth the ink used to label them. Others will tell you exactly what I am sharing with you now. WOf faith is heresy. A blend of all sorts of new age mysticism, theosophy christian science thinking all rolled together. .
New Age,Christian Science…they copied our works and not the other way!…Jesus taught that we can say to the mountains…and if you dispute His words,you should bring it up with Him…..When reality breaks through..it hurts!!!There you showed your bitterness,and shallowness!!!..IT REALLY HURTS WHEN I DISCOVER THAT I HAVE TO CARRY THE CROSS…THAT I HAVE TO HOLD ON TO MY CONFESSIONS!..THAT I HAVE TO STAND FIRM,COME STORMS OR RAIN!!!PAUL WAS HURT AND HE KNEW THAT HE SUFFERED FOR THE LORD IS PART AND PARCEL OF THE CONSECRATION….in the world you shall have tribulations,and this truths hurts!!!how many have broken down and weakened ,and even died because they believe in the Lord Jesus?
The christian science occult people were there long before Hagin and Hagin borrowed the material from them. In some places word for word. So that excuse is busted. Jesus made it clear he was God so that is busted as well. Denying his deity is heresy. Claiming to be a Yawah or some incarnation of God is also busted. So your busted as a heretic left right and centre. As you faith is in your confession rather than in God means you are not even a christian. Faith is trusting God and not yourself. You may talk the talk, but you dont know how to walk the walk. You certainly dont know God and God is not some one arm bandit that you can pull and God has to come running to fulfill some positive confession. Witches were doing that sort of thing since witchcraft started. My advice is truly repent before its too late!!!!!
uc ministries you have backed everything up with the word of God. I remember our pastor would not let us and frounded us if we read anything if it didnt refer somehow to their doctrine. I wonder what is frankie afraid if he might get saved. I challenge him to investigate to see if he is right or wrong. Also to bring a poor little girls death into the picture like he has will be judged. Today the shaking is going on by god and everything that wil be shakin will be shaken. Frankie I beleive god has drawn you to this web site so he can reaveal the truth to you.
Jesus said that the Devils came to kill.Edwards” daughter and many others live in a world where Satan is the god.Truths are ruthless,and lies of the Demons are wicked.Many had been disillusioned when they failed to get their loved ones healed and set free from death and sicknesses,lost many battles in life to the Demons–despite their prayers,cries and claiming God’s healings-postive Confessions and so-called Faith.
God”s Words never back down-without Faith,one cannot please God,and he that wavers,let him not thinks he shall receives anything from the Lord.Jesus taught about people who had littel Faith-and little Faith was rebuke…and Centurion who had gret Faith…and there are Christian who had unwavered Faith,matured in the Lord and were made strong by God’s Words and their dilligence in seeking them.
Human tragedies happened everyday to every person,and there is none who is of the exception-we all shall die soon,loved ones to be separated,seeing one by one leave us,friendships torn assunder,etc…It is the Word Faith Movement,the Charismatic Christians whose eyes were enlighten offers greater light and blessings for our world,and with our Helper,the Comforter-He did marvellous breakthroughs and inroads in shaking the Kingdom of Darkness,led many millions free together with us.
Kenneth Copeland help spread the Gospel,the very Gospel as was professed in our Statements of Faith,with distinction,and his works is responsible for the many millions coming to Christ,whose written records of Salvation was said to be 54 millions–actual records.Imagine if you crooked people happen to hinder him and poison him sucessfully then,you would be worst than Hitler in causing and directly responsibile for the souls of millions in Hell Fires today.
Kenneth Copeland works was,the main contributor of monies and others in supporting ReinHard Bonke Gospel rallies,Miracle Rallies in Africa continent. These are men who love the Lord Jesus,and were persecuted and hated by fellow stupid brethren,those dumb Theologians,those who were twice dead,brute beasts…. as they go around seeking to defame,to distort and to assumed the role as the accuser of our brethren,and poisons the well so that other brethren may drink it,and more would become enmities of God…Can you imagine Paul inquired,Who are you Lord that I am persecuting,and while he was on his way to nab Christians!Such blindness and ignorance of Paul then was shocking…
***Running around claiming to be a god does something to you….Reply: It was Lord Jesus who brought the issue,and respond to Pharisees..did not your laws stated that..ye are gods?..Psalms said..ye are gods,children of God in one sentence recorded?..So are we gods or are we not?If we are gods,and all Christians are gods,also meaning we have authoirty and power of Satan that god,and many evil gods,those little demons….Are we not sons of God?..If you refuse to agree and accept that you are sons of God,or suppose we elevated ourselves as gods,then you are horribly mistaken.All Christians a.k.a sons of God,partook the Divine nature of God,except you guys still retain the old corrupted nature,refuse to be in the New Creature in Christ.
We shall Judge Angels,and they are sent to us,as ministering spirits for us who are heirs of Salvation.If we are Co_heirs with Christ and sitted with Christ in the Heavenlies,as Paul told us in his explanation and descriptions,then is it too much to say we are gods?…We don’t claim exclusive priviledge that we are only gods,but we run around teaching and preaching that anyone who want to repent of their sins,and believe on the words of Jesus,also has the honor and power to become sons of God even to them that believe on His name.
Being a child of God and be saved by the Lord Jesus really meant a great deal for us,and as gods,and partook God’s divine nature,and having born again with Divine nature of God,and have the Holy Spirit inside of us,and we are Temple of God–wow..a body where God dwells-wow—Unlike you,everything which is honorable and good,you seek to distort and seek to pervert,and seek to dispute.Lord Jesus prayed..Father…that they be One as we are One…such expressions really breadthtakings!
“”Confessions with what God had say,found to be not workings?….How come I taught a students of 100,and only a few understand the concept,the model and the instructions?….Not all get it.Edward is one of those drop out nut.
If not for the prosperity teachings,where is the explosion and growth of the Christendom?Those who want to throw us into the Dark Ages,ineffective and powerless,and recruiting others to become another foul mouths–even John Macarthur “”advocated that we all should have unclean lips””,and to have foul mouth always…uttering like Isaiah in contrast with Joel Osteen…John Mac like to say..woe is me for I am a man of unclean lips,one who does not find favor with God,and unlike Joel Osteen,he always found favor with God and have positive Confessoins and boastfully confess to want to have clean lips,and want to say honorable and good things through his mouth!…You see,we all should be humble and we should be more foul mouths as ever..( I elaborated to let you guys see better ,on the stupiditie of his attacked on Joel Osteen…Not exact quotes of course)
This kind of Idiots,and like Peter Justins,..they also had followers?
I agree Tracy, I know Mr Edwards as he is on my Facebook and he is a nice guy. The death of his girl was terrible. To throw that at him sickened me to the core. But then that’s part of the trouble with Word of Faith. Running around claiming to be a god does something to you. You loss something!!!! Many of these famous Word of faith people are so hardened in their attitude, So much stinking pride arrogance and selfishness. I know people who knew Copeland personally and they did not like him. Every one i Know who was into Word of Faith developed issues. I knew one business man I tried to speak to over this matter. A suppose christian in church but into the Word of Faith. He was spending alot of time confessing that his business was prospering and then giving himself the credit for what he thought was success. The truth is his business was struggling. His confession was not working. I was told afterwards by someone else who was present that he was on the verge of attacking me..
Faith is trusting God no matter what happens.
Hbr 11:37 They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented;
Not quite the picture of wealth health and prosperity. But there were gloriously saved. God is the object of our faith not ourselves. Scripture makes it clear the man who trusts in the arm of the flesh will fail and that includes his confessions.
2Cr 1:9 But we had the sentence of death in ourselves, that we should not trust in ourselves, but in God which raiseth the dead:
The word of Faith teachers say the opposite to what Paul taught..and the consequences have been far reaching.
The same old lame excuses that people dont get healed because they dont have enough faith . Such lack of faith must include the majority of the faith movement then, For many have had illnesses and were treated by the medical world.. And many more have died. Many have been seen wearing glasses. The fact of the matter Frankie you are just coming out with a very worn and tired pre-written script. Copeland is just another wicked man with a wicked mind. He is the man who dared to suggest that Jesus was raped by his homosexual guards before he went to the cross. Such filth is indescribable sick. Had this happen to the sacrifice it would have been tainted and could not have been used.
JESUS WAS PURE BEFORE DURING AND AFTERWARDS.
That makes Copeland a liar!!!
Copeland also claims that when Jesus said he was the I AM . Otherwise he was and is Yawah. Something which you reject. Copeland says he can claim to be the I AM also. Otherwise Copeland claims to be Yawah God. This poor man is indeed a witch. Is it amazing how men elevate themselves as God and then demean God .
Those who claim to be god find themselves in a place of unteachability and hardening of heart. Searing their conscience because there is a constant need to reassert. their deity and reject the reality that there are not gods..
If you judge the gospel by success wealth prosperity then few if any who are held up as an example in Hebrews 11. God does not look on the outward but the inward.
To take something that was spoken in reference to Ps 82 which was a judgement against those who claimed to be Gods just as the WOF teachers claim. that refers to something that happened in Leviticus. Then try and rip the words “Yea are gods” straight out context and make it refer to a group of people Jesus was not even speaking about is dishonest . I have already shown you that there is only one God. Those who claim to be Gods cannot fulfill the job requirements of a god. Another piece of dishonesty!!!
2Cr 1:9 But we had the sentence of death in ourselves, that we should not trust in ourselves, but in God which raiseth the dead:
I suggest you take heed to these words. Trust in what you confess is trusting in yourself. Paul rejects that and the reality is we dont place our faith in our faith , but in God who is the OBJECT OF OUR FAITH!!!
Frankie you have spewed out hatred against John Edwards who is really a nice guy. What you have said against him because of the death of his daughter is sadly typical of word of faith mentality. David Wilkerson, who was one of the godliest men around . Justin Peters who is a great teacher. D. R. McConnell whose only crime was to show that Hagin borrowed almost word for word his theology from the mind science cults. The many other numerous articles and testimonies which have gone into more depth on this subject than I have. I know and understand where you are coming from because I have debated word of faith people before. God loves you and cares enough to tell you to seek him and not the Hagins, Copeland’s and the other bunch who profess The Word of Faith teachings. You are not a god or even GOD. But from past experience I know that your heart is so hardened right now you cant hear see or even acknowledge your error . I hope and pray that God will open your eyes and lead you in humility to the true cross and the victory that every believer stands on. But for now your are finished slandering men who would have helped you. FINISHED !!!
Your very first words Frankie from the lips of Copeland himself “: “Dont be disturbed when people accuse you of thinking you are God…They crucified me for saying that I was God. But I didn’t claim I was God; I just claimed I walked with Him and that He was in me” ..Kenneth Copeland
Now its amazing how much you want to be called a god at the expense of denying Jesus divinity.
But also the very fact that copeland placed words in Jesus mouth which he never spoke, thus making him a liar. Such is the depths of the deception played out here.
Jhn 10:32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me? The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
Now the Jews knew fine well what Jesus was calling himself, and just maybe he had a right to do so because he was God. Prophecy and scripture has made it clear who Jesus was.
The fact that the wof teachers reject this only further makes it clear how deceptive and deceitful the WOF is.
Your very first words Frankie from the lips of Copeland himself “: “Dont be disturbed when people accuse you of thinking you are God…They crucified me for saying that I was God. But I didn’t claim I was God; I just claimed I walked with Him and that He was in me” ..Kenneth Copeland
Now its amazing how much you want to be called a god at the expense of denying Jesus divinity.
But also the very fact that copeland placed words in Jesus mouth which he never spoke, thus making him a liar. Such is the depths of the deception played out here.
Jhn 10:32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me? The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
Now the Jews knew fine well what Jesus was calling himself, and just maybe he had a right to do so because he was God. Prophecy and scripture has made it clear who Jesus was.
The fact that the wof teachers reject this only further makes it clear how deceptive and deceitful the WOF is.
Frankie your the idiot. I dont think you even know anything about the word of faith.I If you have read any of hagins books you would realize he said that we were on the same level as God. How can the creation say that when he is so far above us that it isnt funny. Thats why we well never be god.. There was only one Jesus and your not it. Your buddy kenneth copeland is living a lie and its about ready to fall on him. He didnt get his revelation from god but shut himself up in a garage and listen to kenneth Hagin tapes. The other day he told his congregation he wanted to do something. lookup so they did then he said god just took a snap shot of you. Ridiculs isnt it. The misery this so called faith movement has brought people through can only wind up one way. Just like that house on sinking sand. It wasnt build on CHrist but on the doctrine of man.
Frankie your the idiot. I dont think you even know anything about the word of faith.I If you have read any of hagins books you would realize he said that we were on the same level as God.
***Reply:Hagin’s books are everywhere,and all across the world.Everyone who reads it can testify to you,that it is not so,for Hagin calls Jesus as Lord,so if he calls Him Lord,how can he,Hagin can ever teach that we r all equal or same level as God?You don’t call someone Lord if you are on the same level,isn’t it?…Are you sane and sound?
We act for the Lord here,represent Him or as an ambassador of Christ,it doen’t mean we are at the same level with God.
It is to your perils for slandering him.Your perils for making accusation about him and his teachings.You are warned.God sees and will judge who is right and who is wrong.
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How can the creation say that when he is so far above us that it isnt funny. Thats why we well never be god.. There was only one Jesus and your not it. Your buddy kenneth copeland is living a lie and its about ready to fall on him. He didnt get his revelation from god but shut himself up in a garage and listen to kenneth Hagin tapes. The other day he told his congregation he wanted to do something. lookup so they did then he said god just took a snap shot of you. Ridiculs isnt it. The misery this so called faith movement has brought people through can only wind up one way. Just like that house on sinking sand. It wasnt build on CHrist but on the doctrine of man.
Reply: The only House that is growing stronger in all over the world,and one who preach the Full Gospel of Christ’s salvation,healings and blessings—are our denomination.The accuser of our brethren,Satan,he cannot not hinder us anymore!
Copeland has been well documented as saying that he got his message from listening to hagins books and tapes. Then boasting that he could preach them better than Hagin. So Tracy was right in what she said. So once again your debunked Popularity does not mean success in Gods eyes. Broad is the way that leads to destruction .and narrow is the way that leads to life and few that find it. So another debunked idea.
Telling your Frankie your on the wrong team playing on the wrong side.
As for Hagins Books being every where ? They were everywhere. True at one time Hagins books were in most Christian book shops . Now there binned as rubbish. He has been so exposed as a cult leader that few Bible Book shops now push this mans rubbish. In fact I spoke to the man who was running Christian Book shop some years back. He had loads of Hagin books on sale. It took less than a minute to show him that Hagin was a LIAR and a FRAUD. Within a week the books were gone. Word of faith has been so well documented and debunked that all thats left are and sad to say people like yourself who are desperate to validate these men at any cost. That includes having to lie to yourself.
The problem you have Frankie is that it is easy to hate what others are telling you, because you can then reject what they are saying. David wikerson was no moonie yet you were decrying him. Justin peters is no Moonie , yet you were decrying him, Apologetic ministries are most certainly not moonies and you were decrying them. You are simply running out of excuses to hate. The Word of Faith has been so well documented exposed and debunked that people are leaving their ranks left right and centre. Its hurting these modern cultist where it should hurt them in their pockets.
Even if you reject what I am telling you , there are hundreds out there telling you the same message. They have probably documented the Word of faith in a far greater detail than I have. Many are EX MEMBERS of the word of faith like Edwards is.
Tell me HOW MUCH MONEY HAVE YOU BEEN SENDING THEM? because they have sadly suckered in alot of dear people over the years. There preachers are just snake oil sales men pimping the gospel for a buck. Popularity wealth success is not a pre-condition to proving one is right. Few of the apostles lived into old age. The early church was persecuted and hounded. Hebrews 11 speaks out against the modern day mentality of success. True success can never be measured on such basis , but in ones relationship with God.
This is an interesting testimony on Hagin: >>>Kenneth Hagin: Loon Or Liar?
I saw a poll on a former RHEMA graduates website where he had been asking people if they thought Kenneth Hagin was legitimate, delusional, or in it for the money. If I remember correctly, most people believed that he was in it for the money. My wife believes that Kenneth Hagin was delusional and suffered from mental illness. I myself believe that he cooked up his visions for the money. Kenneth Hagin claimed eight one on one visitations from Jesus Christ in which he received special sermons, insights and extra revelation. The main reason that I believe that he was lying is because his visions contain several critical errors in them which violate Scripture.
One being that he had seen God sitting on His Throne, but did not look into His face. This has to be a lie, because the Word of God teaches that God is an invisible spirit and that he cannot be seen. Kenneth Hagins accounts of his visions and trips to Heaven and Hell contain many such violations of Scripture. In one vision, Hagin claims that Jesus gave him a special sermon which he later named “How to write your own ticket with God”. What heresy. Galatians 1:4-8 forbid us from receiving additional revelation.In another occasion, Hagin claimed to see the nail holes in the palms of Jesus, but all historical evidence of crucifixion points to the facts that the nails were driven into the wrist.
One of the most damning facts about Kenneth Hagin’s integrity is the proven and known fact that he stole and plagiarized massive amounts of EW Kenyon’s New Age writings. When confronted about this, he claimed that he had received these writings from God. That blows me away. And what really blows me away is that I fell for this man’s deceit for 14 years. What is even sadder, is all the Word of Faith preachers out there that refuse to open their eyes to the truth and to the facts. Word of Faith people do not want to know the facts. They cannot stomach the truth.
You Frankie continue to throw out railing accusations and continue to make peoples life miserable. Its time you get with the program of god. Pray the sinners prayer and ask god to come into your life. Its true you arent bearing good fruit. I dont disrespect you but I want you to be set free. Our pastor who is word of faith but is under The banner faith christian fellowship ,does alot of good works but in the long run it wont make any difference. My wife and I have led hundreds of people to christ and weve always showed them the love of Christ. Repent of your blaspemy because God will foregive you except of the Blashemy Holy Ghost . When you qestion the diety of Christ when he was on earth or think your self into a small god. When someone like kenneth hagin says jesus came to him eight differnt time to show him new revelation I always thougt it was The Holy Ghost who gives us revelation. When Jesus walked the earth he proved who he was. Why dont you prove who you are. Are you an attack dog from Rhema? Or the devil?
Frankie you do always ere. Just like a someone who maybe with a harlot he is still part of that mess. You may not agree with everything with the word of faith you must belive that weather part or all you do ere. You have truly sold out to a pack of lies. Today the t.v. preachers (word of faith) are prostituting the gospell. Send me money and god will grant any wish. If it isnt in the scripture they make it up. You cant by pass the Spirit of god and think god is blessing you. Please get out of that faithless mess before it is to late.
You Frankie continue to throw out railing accusations and continue to make peoples life miserable.
Frankie’s Reply: I am the only one in all across this planet earth,warning you guys not to make railing accusations,and the only one now,telling you guys what the the Office of Satan were,and what his ministries were–that is–as the accuser of our brethren.
It was the accusers attacking the Faith Movements,Hagin,etc…making all sorts of railing accusations and distorting their doctrines.Many of my rebuttals were not reflected here,perhapd technical glitches,perhaps your guys didn’t actuall delete it,or censored it.This,I DON’T KNOW.One thing is true,it is unfair that my other replies gone missing from here.
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Our pastor who is word of faith but is under The banner faith christian fellowship ,does alot of good works but in the long run it wont make any difference. My wife and I have led hundreds of people to christ and weve always showed them the love of Christ.
Reply: You have testified about your Pastor having done a lot of good works,and by his fruits we know the tree,and you want to make us to believe your Pastor didn’t err.That is good!Prasie God!!…But,you believe in the long run,it may not be good..for some reasons,unknown and unverified….?…You exhibited here your foolishness,and exalt my warnings as sound,it must an act of God!???
Since you led many to Christ,hopefully you don’t turn them into bearers of false witness against others,or make them slanders others….Otherwise you turn them to become the twice the child of hell under such deception!
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Repent of your blaspemy because God will foregive you except of the Blashemy Holy Ghost .
Reply: What have I said that you deem that I had blasphemy against God,and the reasons of such warnings?
Lord Jesus said,the sins of blasphemy committed in this age,or even when we are in Heaven or in the new age there,such sins will never be forgiven.The Lord also warned that in the future,if anyone then were to commit such sins,they will never be forgiven also.
Just in case you cannot show where have I blaspheme God,and by asking me to repent of a ficticious charge,you sinned against God and will be in real trouble with God…..
Or you any-o-how made assumptions and distort my words and called it “”blasphemous””you shall aggravate your sins.
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When you qestion the diety of Christ when he was on earth or think your self into a small god.
Reply: No where have we ever question the Deity of Christ.It was Jesus who said,He,quoting the scriptures,in respond to the charges and accusers hurled at him for claiming to be God,or equal with God…
Jesus explained..and this is my explanation for you …ye are called gods..and it is all right and OK,can I not claim it also?
I made it so simple in my analogy,and sure you can see it this time!
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When someone like kenneth hagin says jesus came to him eight differnt time to show him new revelation I always thougt it was The Holy Ghost who gives us revelation.
Reply: Our Lord Jesus gave revelation to Apostle Paul also.The Holy Ghost is the third Person of the Trinity,and He is also our Comforter,our Counsellor and Teacher.He also will take of the Father’s words and give it to us,and HE will glorify and point others to Jesus,the Savior.
After Jesus was risen from the dead,He appeared to many,and they even touch Him.Can we restrict the freedom of Jesus,and where He wants to visit and to whom He wants to talk with?Jesus Christ is the King of Kings and Lord of Lords!
My Lord Jesus Christ really had appeared to Kenneth E Haggin 8 times according to his testimony,and we believe it was a true accounts.If you dispute it,and disstort the accounts,and stand as opposite,and enmity to his accounts—you will be fine/OK only when Hagin’s account is false.But if Hagin’s story is true,you offend the Lord Jesus,Kenneth,and had shown harm to fellow brethren…so a deeper Hell you will definitely go…..
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When Jesus walked the earth he proved who he was. Why dont you prove who you are. Are you an attack dog from Rhema? Or the devil?
Reply: No,I am not an attack dog from Rhema,nor am I of the devil…I am here trying to save your souls,and warned you of your status.
I repeat again: I am warning you guys to stop being a slanderer,or distort the words of late Kenneth E Hagin.
Stop being an accuser of our brethren.
Stop being an attack dog against the Faith Movement…
I am contending earnestly the Faith which was given to me by God,through His servants.
There have been many that have taken the same journey as you have. I appreciate all of your testimonies. I too rejoice that God has brought out so many. I am at the present moment compiling a number of testimonies. The testimonies were originally on John Edwards’s blog site. He gave me permission to repost them. There will be available shortly. I hope they can be useful and encouraging . God bless!!
Frankie it is no good reposting numerous posts that contain the same ranting and ravings. You seem unable or unwilling to debate the issue , or prove your point. The old “DONT TOUCH GODS ANOINTED, is simply old hat. The Bible says test the spirits to see if they are from God. People tested the WoF and found it wanting. Paul also said that a man that is a heretic after the first and second admonition reject. Personlay you have been given numerous pieces of information. Which you have dismissed to your own cost. Some of which have gone into great detail. Probably more than I have. You dismissed them and rejected them outright. WELL THATS YOUR PROBLEM not mine. I have numerous testimonies articles including my own which show the that whole wof movement is not christian ,
Bible is the world’s best-selling book of all time. We believe it is the Word of God. It is total truth and provides us with principles for every area of life.
•We believe in One True God. We believe He is alive and wants to have a personal relationship with us. He co-exists in three Persons – Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
•We believe that Jesus is the Son of God. He was born of a virgin and lived a sinless life. While He lived on earth He performed supernatural miracles. He died to take away the sins of the world. He was crucified on a cross, buried in a tomb, was resurrected from the dead and He ascended into heaven. We believe He will return to earth a second time in the future.
•We believe man has sinned against God. Adam and Eve were the first humans and were created pure but wilfully broke God’s laws. As a result all of us have sinned and need forgiveness.
•We believe there is salvation only through faith in Jesus Christ. He died on the cross that our sins may be forgiven. He was buried and after three days He was raised from the dead. Sin and death could not defeat Him.
•We believe you must be born again to go to heaven. When you put your trust in Jesus and believe in what He did for you, the Holy Spirit changes you on the inside.
•We believe in water baptism, not by sprinkling water on your head but by being fully immersed in water. In this way we follow Jesus’ example.
•We believe in the Holy Spirit baptism. The evidence of the Holy Spirit baptism is the supernatural ability to speak in tongues – a language we have not learned or have known.
•We believe the Holy Spirit gives us special gifts. He empowers us and gives us the ability to do what Jesus did here on earth.
•We believe we should live holy lives. Through obedience to the principles and teachings in the Bible we can live lives that please God.
•We believe in supernatural healing. We pray for the sick because we believe God still works miracles today.
•We believe that everyone who has become a Christian should remember Him by regularly participating in communion.
•We believe in eternal life and judgement. Those who have committed their lives to following Jesus will spend eternity with Him in heaven. However those who have not will be punished for their sins.
***WOF…if you attack us and our fundamental Faith,as was expressed above,you are enmity of the Faith we have,and you are false teachers…..We cannot have fellowship with anyone who oppose our core beliefs.
Kenneth E Hagin,Kenneth Copeland,Cho Yonggi,and all WOF suscribed,accept and confess on the above,both in private circles,and in public circles and inside the heart and souls,and we live with such Faith.
My OH MY what a fantasy>>> what a tale. The reality is you exposed your own heart Frankie.
You are making up the story as you go along and making subtle changes as you do it.
Great piece of utter drivel. However truth won out and truth will continue to win out. So far how many people have you accused of something? Try pointing closer to home. The word of faith teachers is pedalling a false doctrine of demons. You ranting and raving is sadly typical of word of faith conditioning, Seen so many times before. You turned men into Gods and God into man. Sadly you simply have not got a clue. Even trying to take scriptures out of context. Hagin and crew are the ones who have merchandises and pimped the gospel to their own ends. The truth is in the pudding their rich and so many who have given to their cause are not.
Believe the only person to appear to Hagin was either a demon or his imagination was on overload. Many WOF people have come to the conclusion that he was mentally ill and his visions were the result of these fits of fancy. Try reading some of the articles. Even people who were involved with Prosperity movement came to that conclusion. In the end he gave himself over to a demon which controlled him . Being filled with the Holy Spirit does not make you incarnate LOL. Any more than the tabernacle was itself God. God dwelt within but it was simply a covering. I presume you would have men worship the creature more than God, or the tabernacle more than the God of the tabernacle.
There can only be one incarnate individual and that was Jesus. To claim you are incarnate is to claim that you are yawah God (john 1: 1-3) and that everyone, including angels should worship you. Sorry you do not fulfil the requirements of Yawah.
Frankie you have said “Demons do incarnate people, possessed them,and speak through their vocal abilities” That tells me you have absolutely no idea what the word INCARNATE means. It works one way. God became clothed in a human body. But he remained God at all times. He cannot be anything less than God.
GOD THE SON as explained through the DOCTRINE OF INCARNATION
The Doctrine of Incarnation is a fundamental theological teaching of orthodox (Nicene) Christianity, based on its understanding of the New Testament.
• Incarnation is the belief that the second person in the Godhead, also known as God the Son or the Logos (Word), “became flesh” when he was miraculously conceived in the womb of the Virgin Mary. The word incarnate means “to make into flesh” or “to become flesh”.
• The incarnation represents the belief that Jesus, who is the non-created second person of the triune God, took on a human body and nature and became both man and God.
• As traditionally defined, the divine nature of the Son was joined but not mixed with human nature in one divine Person, Jesus Christ, who was both “truly God and truly man”.
That has been the basis of Biblical Christianity from the beginning. The basis of which you deny. That makes you a heretic . No true Christian would deny that fundamental claim.
A more secular dictionary explains the term incarnate like this in a wider context. But can still get the term broadly right. in•car•na•tion
1.
a. The act of incarnating.
b. The condition of being incarnated.
2. Incarnation Christianity The doctrine that the Son of God was conceived in the womb of Mary and that Jesus is true God and true man.
3. A bodily manifestation of a supernatural being.
4. One who is believed to personify a given abstract quality or idea.
5. A period of time passed in a given bodily form or condition: hopes for a better life in another incarnation
Number 3 makes it clear that Jesus was both truly God and truly man. Now if even the secular dictionary can get this right , what does that say about you?
If you had read any of the articles you would have seen why Edwards ran from the WOF. He left it because it is heresy.
Now God loves you and he desires that you will bow the knee , repent and get yourself right with him. BEFORE ITS TOOOOO LATE!!! EVERY MAN IN SCRIPTURE WHO LAID CLAIM TO DEITY WAS HUMBLED BY GOD. Jesus can and will be the only God man. The Only true incarnate there ever was.
Frankie lee have you had to much bean soup because I can smell you clear over here.. What a ridiculas thing to caim to be a god. Your know in Jim jones league. Now you can get your own little followers and they can worship you. You have said some very cruel and noctous things. I cant judge you but I can judge your fruit and it is rotten tomatos. Is there any hope for you? It is your own fault when you throw out stupid coments that people wont except you. You cant claim to be the incarnation of god when that title belongs to Jesus Christ. You have caimed so many things that isnt even in the bible. The word of faith claims that jesus was merly mortal. That he wasnt divne but you claim that you are god. How rediculas.
The word of faith claims that jesus was merly mortal. That he wasnt divne but you claim that you are god. How rediculas…..Reply: Now who is ridiculous here,huh?…There are 10 000 denominations and entire Christendom lay their weight on anyone who dare to declare that Jesus is only mortal,and stop there. …Again,why slanders and declare falsely against us,assumed that we said that Jesus was not divine?…If anyone said that Jesus is not divine–he/she is demonic to the letter…and to say that we,the Christians and the Word Faith Movements deny Lord Jesus as divine–he/she is worst than the Devils himself!!!
WE REPEAT,JESUS CHRIST WAS BORN OF VIRGIN MARY,JESUS IS GOD,THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD,AND HE IS COMING AGAIN FOR HIS BRIDE,AND HE WILL SEPARATE THE FALSE ACCUSERS AND REJECT THEM FOREVER.
Frankie how sad it is that you rely on the testimony of dead mans bones. Like I said Kenneth Hagin was deflocked as a minister in good standing in the assembly of god. There must of been some serious problem to be kicked out of a astablished denomination. Could it because of his hereicial views? It is to late for him but not yet for you. The mountain of eividence is unsurmountable. Please before it is to late?
UC Could you coment on joel olsteans new book.
Get your facts straight John Edwards. Hope you had had patience and you definitely are offended. Love your fellow Christians.
God still loves u and will forgive u.
I would be very interested in seeing your replies after PLEASE watching these 3 videos first as contained within this webpage http://www.watchmanforjesus.blogspot.co.uk/2011/08/word-of-faith-deception-everything-you.html
Excelent . I love Justin Peters work and ministry.
Frankie to claim that jesus was just like we are when he walked the earth is shear utter blasphemy. To belittle Jesus in that way is already been debunked. In 1976 I was setting in an assembly of God Church. I had been on drugs for Aprox. 5 years. I was aprox. 120 lbs. My mind was gone and I didnt have 2 cents to my name. As I listened to a West virginia coal minner preacher give an alter call I said god if you are real could you reveal yourself to me. I need help. Immediatley he did. I seen a vision of Christ. I needed a answer to my life. As I gazed at the vision of Christ I looked into his eyes. He was truly God in every way. He comanded the universe. His eyes pierced my soul. He reached out to me and I accepted him in that little assembly of God church. Frankie you have lied every which way and thank God he allowed me to see that vision of Jesus back in 1976 during the Jesus movement. Our pastor word of faith said Jesus was just like us. God only dwelt in him. But he wasnt the truth. He was the second part of the trinity the word of God he was God incarante with a divine nature who had privilages to his deity and his father is the great I am Just like him.
The mormans in some respect have some of the same beliefs as the word of faith only they beleive they have to work their self to god hood but the word of faith preaches they are god. The mormans prophet is Joseph smith the word of faith prophet is Kenneth hagen. The mormans books of choice is book of Mormans and pearl of great price. The word of faith books is e.w. Kenyon and Kenneth copeland. The mormans head church is in Salt lake city, The word of faith mother church is Remha in Tulsa olkahoma. The mormans believe the self proclaimed prophet Josheph Smith that every word was spoken by god. The word of faith beleive that Kenneth hagin moved strictly in the gifts the spirit, and every word he spoke from the pulpit was the infalable word of god without mistake. God completed the Bible 2000 yrs ago and he desnt approve of all this nonsence that these men have added to his word and published and someday they will stand before the great white throne of judgement and their jaws will drop when they see the God of the universe.!!!!!
Brethren, why attack each other isn’t the devil enough. The Word of God is true and it works, you don’t believe it, Don’t worry it will not work for you
I have studied, over a 15 year period, the teachings of New Thought, primarily the Church of Religious Science, and after leaving that, have studied the bible of course, have books, tapes, CDs, a library that is quite complete from the sermons of Smith Wigglesworth to Kenneth E. Hagin, John G. Lake and more. As an Evangelist, I find this article and some of the comments to be full of errors and opinions based on something other than biblical truths. I pray that people that are new to christianity are not influenced by this entire website. Peace and Grace be with you from a “Word of FAITH believer” who has been living on far less than the poverty level of income.
Recently I went through some things that just kept pouring in. It seemed that the enemy just kept pouring it on. I felt like the disiples in the boat. The storms kept hitting my boat. Last night my sister died. We were not real close but this was just one more nail. What was I to do. Confess the word to change my situation. Or trust in the lord. Im not going to use witchcraft like most of the word of faith teachers teach. I choose to make my petitions known to god. Today the depression left and so did the roadblocks. Our Pastor taught us that faith is Gods power in action at our level of belief. But He is soveirgn and can do anything he wants. Kenneth copeland is the biggest transgresser of Gods word today. I went one time to HIs conference. I believe it was in Kansas. I noticed that Glora copeland advertised that night she was going to have healing meeting. She procaimed her version of the word and said claim your healing and you will be healed. Where was God in this. Its like to procaim his word and if you dont get healed and have super faith it is your fault.. So I went because I fell off my ladder and sprained my good foot. So she started to praying for people in that conferense. When she came to me shurely I will confess the word and I will be healed. How exciting. But folks no one I no of got healed. Their was no testimoney at all. Folks god is not a computer or you cant use witchcraft because witches beleive when they cast their spell their god will bring it to past. No the faith that was once delivered to the saints is alive and well. You dont use Gods word like witches to cast their spell but you dig into the word and belive what it says and by all mean include THE GREATEST AND ONLY SOVIERGN GOD OF THE UNIVERSE.
What carries me on no matter what I go through is GODS GRACE IS SUFFICENT FOR TODAY. I want to thank Jesus for dying on a old rugged cross so I can have eternal life. Thats where it starts not in hell.
Brother have a Jesus filled Christmas keep the faith. We love you and appeciate your stance. May you and yours have a prosperous new year.
Have a Merry Christmas and a prosperous new year.
The person that is involved with the word of faith is a sad sort of individual. To have that kind of pressure on your shoulders to determine what you confess will determine the outcome because according to your doctrine God will not even act unless it is you who gives him permission. What happens if you say the wrong thing and he wipes out california. Isnt that silly the god that created trillions and zillions of stars has to wait for you before he can act. How about his Son spending three days in hell to finish paying for our sins. He had a net thrown over him and was tormented by Satan and his demons when he defeated him on the cross and was victorious And the temple curtain that lead to the holy of holys was rent in twain. You dont even believe in the incarnation of jesus christ but you believe in your own incarnation. Lets see if it were possible and you took a 283 chevy engine and put it in a voltswagon would it still be a 283 engine or a voltswagon engine? There have been so many silly things that the word of faith prosperity teachers have come up with. All the way send me 1ooo dollars for your miracle to Oral Roberts getting his seed faith message from a farmer who planted seed and had a bumper crop. Or benny hinn going to katherine koolmans grave and talking to her. What Im saying please come back to the one and only true savior because he is waiting at the cross.
I thought I would post today and say howdie uc. This is after the first of the year and I have had a break thru. For the last 16yrs. I have been trying to understand faith. Is It power that I posess, Is it favor with god and he grants you your wishs. Or is it as big as a mountain Or is it Gods power in action at my level of belief. He pointed me to a scripture. Math. 17:20 And jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustaard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to younder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you. Then it hit me what I need is mustard seed faith . Will I already have it because I have been dealt a measure of faith. Seems prertty reasonable to me. A mustard seed so small and can speak to that mountain and it will remove and cast into the sea. What a deal. Now the wof preachers say that we have the God kind of faith so I ask myself why does God need faith for anyway.Heb. 11:3 Through faith we undestand that the worlds were framed by the word of God so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear. If god had not even given us faith we could even understand creation and how it was not formed. He ia soverign and all powerful. It is I who need to trust god and believe that what ever happens to me it is for my best interrest. When paul and silas was in the inner prison at midnight they were praying and singing unto god and it moved god so greatly that there was a earth quake and the prison doors flu open. Can you imagine what kind of faith they had . To sing praises unto God just after they were beaten and thrown into prison. If we had wof kind of faith we could stop huricanes, tornadoes, Fires, world Hunger, and the sky would be the limit but it still takes God at the other end. Doesnt it.
Today it is the last of the last days before Trib. God is using ministries like yours to truly get the gospel out that you will not find on TBN or any the other wof outlets. I want to read something I read while searching the scriptures. It is found in I Peter 3:14; But and if ye suffer for righteusness sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled; And also it says be ready to give an answer. I am looking forward this year like you Bro because I want to be in that last movement of god in spreading the truth. Pray for that pastor in Iran. He is going to go before the hanging judge because he converted from islam to christianity and in Iran it is a capital offense. Also If 12 men turned their world upside down then this Blog can turn our world upside down. Be in Pease Brother U
For the eyes of the Lord are over the righteous, and his ears are open unto their prayers But the face of the Lord is against them who do evil. And who is he that will harm you, if ye be followers of that which is good? And who is he that will harm you,if ye be followers of that which is good? But and if ye suffer for righteousness sake, happy aare ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled. After I talked to the pastor I was trouble. And turned it over and over in my head. Did I say the wrong thing. Maybe I was to mean. Or What am I doing to try to explain things to him like the divinity of Christ, or What really happened when Christ Died untill he was resserected. What went on. Will I was searching further in comentaries and the word when I came across that scripture. The word stood out and it said dont be troubled. And then the Holy Spirit answered all my questions that I had. I now can point out in the scripture what is the real truth and have a firm foundation. What I couldnt explin his canned questions that he trough at me I can now threw the word.
Hello John
Praise God for bringing you out. My wife came out from Rhema Jbg almost 20 years ago. I am always amazed when people come out of this great bondage, but then the Lord is able to call His own. Keep the Faith brother.
Rev edwards, I am greatly encouraged just by reading your testimony. And I am grateful that you haaad the humility to retrace your steps in order to find what went wrong.
It is a great encouragement to me and it also gives me the boldness to speak to my friends who are still trapped in those tents of wickedness. God bless you.
Thank you for this! I too have been a victim of my own blindness to the truth. I met the Real God in January of 1980. But I was attending a truly dead church. I knew I needed a change. But I walked, unknowingly, right into the jaws of word of faith. It didn’t take long for me to realize something was terribly wrong. I knew it had something to do with the teaching, yet I could not define it. Now I know their interpretation was wrong, based on a single scripture and completely out of harmony with the whole Word. The wickedness of their hearts saw that single scripture as license for the flesh, and they jumped on board with great enthusiasm. I was led astray, but I knew their ‘god’ was not the same God I had met through the bible. Still, as a baby Christian, I did not have a strong enough ability to discern truth from error. I just knew something was wrong. Sorry for rambling. Thanks for listening. If you ever compose a book of collections of testimonies like ours, let me know. Please pray for me. I’m still not right with God.
Ginny UCMINISTRIES is not John Edwards but I know John well and he is a great guy. His testimony continues to encourage and help many who have been deceived by the word of faith. The very fact you came to recognize that something was wrong is a good sign. The one thing I have personal came to realize is that God is a great teacher encourager and shepherd. Those who love him will be led unto a straight path. God bless
I am so happy that another one has been removed from the jaws of the word of faith. There will be a recovery process but the lord is good at that. I have a question that has really been bothering me. Being Kenneth Hagin Copelan and most of the T.V. evangelist do not aspouse the doctrine of Christ Does that mean they are still in there sins or they do not have the father. If that be the case where do the congrgations fall in the sceme of eternity. Our pastor taught that he was responsible if he was not teaching the right truth not the congregation. Thanks.
I have found out that there is life after word of faith. I know there may be some out there like my friend who said well Im going to leave just as soon as my wife leaves. Sometimes change is very hard. But remember when we sit under false doctrine our ears can become dull to the real truth. You may be in a wof church and maybe you are friends with the pastor or with other christians in the church. Everyone wants to be accepted and maybe you are accepted where your at. Maybe you have fear when you think about leaving a church but if you do leave be prepared. Once you leave your hearing will be cleared up. All of that false doctrine you have been hearing will cause you to investigate the Scriptures to see if really it was true what they said. You may blog on web sites like these but you will seek out the truth. I could really bring some scripture out to sway you but I want the holy Ghost to reveal this to you. The enemy is good at turning the scripture around just enough to make it appear like truth but believe me his truth is false. Since I have left there has been alot of healing in my life and praise god for that. I have begun to forget about the past like paul said and aim again for that mark that is set before me. Remember Jesus is the Good Sheperd and he leads us besides still waters. Also I really know now what it means to be justified and sanctified. I can explain in common terms what col 2:9 means. That Jesus didnot go to hell to suffer for our sins and become born again. and so many more things that I was taught. It is one thing to disagree on the rapture but the real tendens of faith is a differnt story. Now that I have my head hooked up with my heart there is not the fight going on. Eph. 4:14 says to not to be tossed around like children and to be turned about with every wind of doctrine.
It seems like u really know very much related to this specific subject matter and that exhibits with this post, labeled “WHY I LEFT THE WORD OF FAITH AND RHEMA by
John Edwards UC Ministries Blog”. Thanks -Desiree
Kenneth hagin was a false prophet , kenneth copeland is one too, And so is Benny Hinn. How can I say this well less look at a real prophet of God. He is found in the account of Eijah and the prophets of Baal. Elijah was a true prophet and he had the fire of God to back him up. Yet he also was a man. l kings 18: 22-40. Then said Elijah unt the people, I, even I only, remain a prophet of the Lord; but Baals prophets are four hundred and fifty men.Let them therefore give us two bullocks; and let them choose on bullock for themselves, and cut it in pieces, and lay it on wood, and put no fire under: and I will dress the other bullock, and lay it on wood, and put no fire under: And call ye on the name of your gods, and I will call on the name of the Lord: and the God that answereth by fire, let him be Godk And all the people answered and said,It is well spoken,And Elijah saud unto the prophets of Baal, shoose you one bullock for yourselves, and dress it first; for ye are many; and call on the name of your gods, but put no fire under,And they took the bullock which was given them, and they dressed it,and called on the name of Baal from morning even until noon, saying, O Baal, hear us, But there was no voice, nor any that answered, And they leaped upon the altar which was made. And it came to pass at noon, that Elijah mocked them, and said, Cry aloud: for he is a god; either he is talking, or he is pursuing, or he is in a journey,or peradventurre he sleepeth,and must be awaked. And they cried aloud, and cut themselves after their manner with knives and lanceets, till the blood gushed out upon them, And it came to pass, when midday was past, and they prophesied until the time of the offering of the evening sacrifice, that there was neither voice, nor any to answer, nor any that regarded. And Elijah said unto all the people, come near unto me, And all the people came near unto him, And he repaired the altar of the Lord that was broken down, And Elijah took twelve stones, according to the number of the tribes of the sons of Jacob, unto whom the word of the Lord came, saying, Israel shall be thy name: And with the stones he built an altar in the name of the Lord: and he made a trench about the altar, as great as would contain two measures of seed, And cut the bullock in pieces, and laid him on the wood, and said, fill four barrels with water, and pour it on the burnt sacrifice, and on the wood, And he said Do it the second time, And he said, Do it the third time, And the water ran round about the altar; and he filled the trench also with water, And it came to pass at the time of the offering of the evening sacrifice, that Elijah the prophet came near, and said, Lord God of Abraham, Isaac, and of Isreal, let it be known thisday that thou art God in Israel, and that I am thy servant, and that I have done all these things at thy word, Hear me, O Lord, hear me, that this people may know that thou art the Lord god, and that thou hast turned their heart back again. Then the fire of theLord fell, and consumed the burnt sacrifice, and the wood, and the stones, andthe dust, and licked up the water that was in the trench.And when all the people saw it, they fell on their faces: and they said, The Lord, he is the God; the Lord, he is the God. And Elijah said unto them escape, And they took them: and Elijah brought them down to the brook Kishon, and slew them there. Oh How serious does the Lord think about false Gods? Oh there was true prophets today. How the people of God would be on the march for God. Well I believe that this dispinsation is coming to a close. We must stand up for god. If it means stepping on peoples toes so be it. We must set our faces like flint and see the propets of prosperity defeated. Does that sound harsh. I dont think so. I have not slew anyone. Should we compromise our faith no. Let rebuild our alters. Let us show who our God really is. I know after reading this passage Im going to change the way I witness. Notice what he said Hear me, O lord hear me o Lord. He respected God By acknowledging god. Excuse my typing but this is a rather long passage. If you have trouble reading it just turn to l kings 18:41 Oh by the way the odds against the prophet of God was 450 to 2. Dont forget god. U.C.
Recently I was looking up some things and I looked in the complete christian Dictionary for Home and School. This is their difinition of faith, 1. Strong belief; trust;confidence; By grace [the unmerited love of God] you have been saved[from eteternal punishment, through faith [in jesus Christ]…eph,2 8 Without faith [in Jesus Christ] it is impossible to please him[in jesus] apart from observing the law [Rom. 3;28] 2.Loyality to ones promises or word of honor,This company always acts in good faith; you can trust them. A system of religious beliefs; religion; the Christian faith Then right about that definition The difinition for fairytale appeared: A STORY about fairies,usu. for children 2.A falsehood. >>>>>>> Because I wanted to seek after faith and wanted it right now I fell in the trap of wof doctrine. It seemed feisable to me that faith in may faith would be the key. But just like everything else that is fairytale so is this. It is a false I came to realize that I have everything in Christ that I need. There is no simple formulas to understand faith but any doctrine that takes us away from Christ is the beginning of apostasy.
I agree with about 50% of what you have to say. I do believe I the power of faith, Hebrews 11 faith applied to Biblical truth. I also believe that according to Isaiah 53, Jesus suffered for our healing.
However, I’m glad to see someone thinking more deeply about the balance to these things. There is suffering in this world.Bad things do happen to believers. And the real danger of an unbalanced teaching on faith is that Christians become disillusioned late in life when they’ve “sowed” their money into ministries but still find they are in debt and struggling financially. I have a close friends who mentored me when I was a teen. She is a devout Christian who had served faithfully in her church and ministered with love to many. Yet she is angry with God because of the false teachings she had followed throughout the years that said, keep sowing your money and God will bless your finances.
So, even though I don’t see eye to eye with you, (partly because I’ve worked for a major seed faith ministry and know God’s presence was strong there in spite of the imperfections) I’m glad you are bold enough to step back and expose the flaws in the word-of-faith movement. Thanks.
I believe the bible is the infaliable word of God. It is how we interpret the word that makes the difference. I remember when I was baptised in water for the 2nd time I forgot to bring a extra set of clothes. But that didnt bother me I jumped in anyway and went home wet. But God new my heart. I have done some crazy thiings in my life. I used to set under this pastor that was healed from a broken back in a logging accident. Well I went down to claim my healing. He touched me on my forhead and I went down like a ton of bricks. As I was laying there I wondered why did I get knock down. Then it came to me. I was demanding from God and he wasnt pleased with it. Will that day I had some steam let out of me. When we put God in the back seat and think god has to do what we demand from him that is not so at all. What are we to do then when we leave a church that has this attitude. I will tell you. Dont back down from the truth but mix it with prayer. The other day I was blogging on a norther web site and this person thought I was a jew because I mintioned Jehovah. He started this hate speech about Jews going to hell. Very racist. I love the jews so the hair stood up on the back of my neck. I quoted the scriptrue where jesus said love your enemies and pray for them that despitefully use you. Well he said he carres a sword for the Lord and he is the avenger. It really is a zoo out there isnt it. I could go on and on but we must tell them the truth but if Christ said to pray for them who despitefully use you what will be the end of those in false doctrine.
Jeremiah 24:30″ Therefore behold, I am against the prophets,” declares the the Lord, ” who steal My words froom each other” (31)”Behold, I am against the prohets,” declares the Lord,who use their tongues and declare,The Lord declares. (32)”Behold, I am against those who have prophesied false dreams,” declares the Lord,and related them, and led My people astray by their falsehoods and reckless boasting; yet I did not send them or command them, nor do they furnish this people the slightest benefit,” decares the Lord. As I thought about this passage I tought about how the devil has a counterfiet gospell that is know different than it was in the garden of eden. Only he is using false prophets and teachers today. They are promiseing wealth, health, and our best life now. Turning and twisting the gospell untill it is not recognizable. But there is a day of recogning coming. In verse (36) For you will no longer remember the oracle of the Lord,because every mans own word will become the oracle, and you have perverted the words of the living God the Lord of hosts, our God.(37) Thus you will say to that prophet, What has the Lord answered you? and What has the Lord spoken? (39) Therefore behold, I shall surely forget you and cast you away from My presence, along with the city which I gave you and your fathers. These word ring out today.
Thank you for this post. I’m trying to sort through all of this. I grew up (since I was born) in WOF so there is A LOT to sort though. I’m in the midst of experiencing #14 right now and it is the toughest most grueling thing I’ve ever had to deal with. The control and manipulation is awful.
Could you elaborate on point 28?
Thanks
Nathaniel I landed on this web site and it is a good place to recover. I broke away from the wof church last yr. after being there over 16 yrs. Believe you me you have friends here and uc offers alot of great support, by that I mean he stands by the truth and backs it up with scripture. There will be ups and downs but you will make it. Just like when a astronaut gets back to earth there comes a time of decontamination or debriefing by the Holy Spirit. I dont want to go into my expierence to deep but I will tell you that you are loved and you may be turned upside down but you will be stronger in the end. Jesus Loves you.
John I don’t know if you know what the unforgivable sin is, called Blasphemy of the Holy Ghost by Jesus, but one day very soon you will find out. You article is full of more lies that Joseph Smith and his Mormon doctrines are. You messed up somewhere along the line and you’re blaming others for your lack of faith. You’re bitter and eaten up with STRIFE! I’m going to do what you didn’t do one time in your article, I’m going to share a verse from God’s Word with you. “For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and EVERY EVIL WORK.” (James 3:16) Now when you attribute the workings of the Holy Spirit to the devil, you have committed the unforgivable sin of blaspheming the Holy Spirit. As for Tracy Myers, you added a word at your will obviously forgetting, “And if any man shall add unto these things,God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book.” (Revelation 22:18) Anyway your lying,and where in the Bible did you find your other lie that says, “He is all powerful and does not need the God kind of faith?” Book, chapter, and verse please. What do you think makes God omnipotent? His faith!
Now I’ve had a few bad experiences with some faith people, but how does that prove the message is wrong? He who is without sin, let him cast the first stone. I don’t know of anyone who hasn’t sinned except for Jesus. And we go back to the word STRIFE again. You talked about (Mark 11: 22-24) I advise you to go on and read (verses 25 & 26) that says “And when you stand praying forgive, if ye have ought against any; that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses. But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.” Unforgiveness is STRIFE, so it no wonder there is EVERY EVIL WORK in your article, especially blasphemy of the Holy Ghost. I would tell you to repent, but you went beyond that! Sat hello to your fellow liar Joseph Smith when you arrive at your eternal destination. What drove you to say these things? Going back to (James 3:16) it was your envying of others success by believing God Word and your failure over unbelief! You’ve let Satan completely rob you of your peace!
One more thing why are you promoting becoming a Muslim???
Rev. Sidney I must say you seem to be full of your self but I am sure you are sincere. Let me speak from my heart . First of all I have read different comments on face book and it seems that you have the typical wof dogma. I was in a wof chruch for 16 yrs. and one key ingredient missing was love. Without love we are merely a sounding brass and tingling cymbal. What you accuse John of blasphemy is him revealing the let down of teaching false doctrine. And what was the result of that.
Testimony: There was a woman will call her Jane who was a faithful follower of Kenneth Copeland. As you will know he has taken over the helm of the wof movement. Will she oneday walked into a furrer in our fair community and picked out a fur coat. She told the lady who was working behind the counter send this to my address . She had the money but as you will know the wof teaches you can have what you say. The woman said mam you didnt pay for it. Well thats okay its mine and my husband will be waiting for it. Well She never received that fur coat. She is divorced form her husband and I dont know if she is in the lord. I know that is a extreme example but it really happened. The ancient knostics belived that they God revealed himself through knowledge and revlation but it was not revelation from god through the holy spirit.
When we think we can create by confessing the word like you claim we set ourselves up in the driverseat. God is soverign and he doesnt give that privlige to any one. Jesus who was God in the flesh said I only do what the father shows me. My pastor who I sat under and left invited me to church Easter and said he was going to preach on the cross. He has his t,v. on the Sonlife T.V. 24/7. I have been praying for him every since I left. The faith industry is a multibillion dollar business today and growing. It has replaced the old rugged cross with heretical teachings.
U.C. today we went to a church and I think it was a emergent church. Everyone was dressed in casulally blue jeans and the lightss were dimed in the sanctuary and a purple glow lit up the worship team. They had three giant screens in front to view the service and also didgital lcd tvs throughout the sanctury. The place was packed and people brought in thier drinks. It was all quite casual and they talked about there 4.7 million dollar building program. The service was only one hour long and something was missing. No pulpit, and where was the Holy Spirit. No preaching about sin but love and joy was abundant. When I got home I looked up something. The emerging church. This had all the finger prints of this. It is the preaching of the word that we needed. Oh the pastor was very carefull to not offend anyone but we need the whole word not just what sounds good socially or some feel good message or to go to the church and one hour later we got out and still the same person. It was quite an experience but one I will soon forget. Lately because of the firm stance I have taken I have felt maybe I have been to condeming on my blogs. So I said God I guess I will back off and well see what happens. Maybe I thought God was punishing me. I felt a little like Pastor John when he left the wof church. But guess what the enemy is unrelenting and wants me to not speak up or address what is wrong with the church. I must not compromise my belief about Christ and allow myself to become lukewarm. The other day at walmart I led a elderly man to christ who never had heard about Jesus. He accepted Jesus right at walmart in Mcdonalds. Praise the Lord. This is what the church should be doing.
Well in looking online because I need answers after my DH died of cancer.Was he a WOF? No.He knew the Lord, never did anything with it.He was good to me and a hard worker.We raised five children.Married 34 years.(Our anniversary is Monday 😦 ) I attend a faith church.I would not say it is on the same order of Copelands and others.My pastor went to Rhema.I have only been back three times since my husband passed. He passed 9/10/11.Needless to say I have not received any phones calls for a check up after my husbands death.Just told to call if I need prayer.Some ladies I attend with and spoke with often did come over.But eventually they forgot too.My husbands death caused me to lose my home.(I am living with my daughter) I am sixty two years old.I feel completely alone and abandoned.At times I do feel the Holy Spirits comfort.The pain is over whelming..The shame is devastating.I confessed and stood for Two years.He was in horrible pain.I am still physically shaking from all this.Crying jags are constant.Am i mad at God?No.I just do not understand.I would not let my dog suffer like that.I never cared about wealth per say.That was not the attraction of WOF for me.I don’t believe God puts cancer on you.I do believe God is a good God and loves us.If I sound confused it is because I am.I lost my DH.My home.MY life as I knew it.I do not know where I belong or what to do next.
Thank you for reading.
I am truly sorry to hear about the death of your Husband. No words can truly express the pain you are feeling right now. The post above is the testimony of a Mr Edwards whose daughter died whilst a minister in a WOF church. He has never quite got over her death. But he did leave the WOF as he started to see through many of its doctrinal problems.
I believe God does and can heal, But I also know that even in scripture not everyone was healed. Even Paul encouraged Timothy to drink a little wine because of a stomach complaint. Sometimes we dont know why suffering happens .
I believe Hebrews 11:1- Is God way of trying answering the question “WHY” The chapter does not answer every question other than to say each of those who are mentioned did have genuine faith in God. They lived their lives according to Gods word. They died. Some saw miracles and some did not. This remember at a time when persecution was ongoing and many would see terrible suffering. The one thing that united all of them was that they did not see the realization of the promises in their life time. But God has made it clear we will together see the realization of all that God has promised. In that we can take comfort that the realization will come. It will be glorious. It will be far more real than what we see in this life
The story does not end at death . Whilst absent from the body and love ones , they are present with Jesus . Scripture says this is far better place. One day we will all be reunited together in Christ Jesus. The will be truly a glorious morning indeed. I am saying this at a time when my own health is not good. I too suffer from alot of health issues and pain. I would be wrong if I said it did not get me down some days. But I also take comfort and hope that the day will come that I will embrace a body that will have no pain and no disease.
So God Bless , keep the faith. I hope we will all soon embrace the fulness of what is coming.
If you are interesting in reading more by Mr Edwards, I have a number of articles on “Sharing the Word.” page .
It has been a while sense I posted but I am alive and well. The enemy has not given up but has come at me in anorther way. You know the truth just go back to the wof church and sit in the pew and you will be just fine. Let me tell you the most important thing to me is winning souls. What kind of a message am I sending to My family friends and the lost . I will stand firm and and let God work on my behalf and not get into error. I must not align myself with false doctrine. Glad your still holding up the flag u.c.
I am sorry to hear about your loss but I attended a wof church for a number of years and what was being preached was not a firm foundation. For me when I got my eyes off of Jesus it was something that seemed feasable. But like you when something happens to me that is devestating and what they preach is taken out of context and packaged up as gospell it is really only a trap. We must alway focus on Christ because he will take us through any thing that we have to overcome in this world.Christ is the word and the word is Christ. These are the last of the last days and the devil is walking about seeking whom he may devour but as long as we hold on the lord he will never forsake us and in him we will be conqurers.
Thanks for notifying me to some of the problems with the rather overly large writting. The result of a recent change in the web site format. My appologies I hope the changes will make it more reasonable to read. Please let me know of any of my other posts have had the same problem. Thanks and God bless.
God bless you John Edwards. I used to belong to Word of Faith International Christian Center in Michigan under Keith A. Butler(I believe in calling a serpent by it’s name)for 16 years and everything you mentioned is everything I experienced at WOFICC. God led me out in 2011 or should I say I finally recognized his leading me out from that cult?! I have been abused looked down on and insulted while partaking in that satanic synagogue. My Aunt is still a part of The big brainwash although I’ve warned her against them. She is still caught up in the cult and becoming more judgmental and materialistic with every visit. I cringe everytime she tells me about something going on in thst church. I’m not there and I don’t want to know or hear anything else about them and their antics. I refused to stay there and wait until the ushers and security became armed guards and the option to leave without drinking the poisoned Kool Aide was no longer an option. I pray my Aunt sees the light soon!
With all love,HOLY SPIRIT have these words for you brother John;JOSHUA 6;2.”I HAVE GIVEN INTO THINE HAND JERICHO…”GOD put Israel faith in action for what they did not have yet as at then,what seemed humanly impossible for them! I have prayed for some folks who died,when I investigated I discovered them to be hypocritical christians in search of fire brigade approach for healing solution! I MYSELF WAS HEALED MIRACULOUS OF CANCER USING FAITH PRINCIPLES AS PREACHED BY KENNETH HAGIN.I DON’T KNOW HAGIN BUT I READ HIS BOOKS AND HIS WORDS ARE TRUE.If a faith preacher is sick and he claims perfect health he is only trusting in the LORD! Smith Wigglesworth did it.If he is granted no answer;he is being tried by the fire of narrow path!IN YOUR OWN WORDS YOU DID NOT SHOW LOVE TO OTHER MINISTERS BECAUSE OF THEIR IGNORANCE,SO YOU FAILED TO WORK MIRACLES AROUND YOU! FAITH IS A GIFT,1 CORINTHIAN 12:9. GOD does not HEAL where people don’t have LOVE 1 CORINTHIAN 13:1-13. JESUS PREACHED FAITH CONSTANTLY…HE USED HIS HEALING AND MIRACLES TO TEACH FAITH CONSTANTLY ! MAtthew 9:29.WHEN THE APOSTLES FAILED TO HEAL MARK 9:14-29.JESUS STARTED WORD OF FAITH…IS HE A CULTIST? DO YOU THINk JESUS DID NOT HAVE PHYSICAL CHALLENGES INCLUDING AILMENTS AND PAINS?HE LIVED AS A HUMAN? BUT ANTI-FAITH TESTIMONIES ARE NOT FOR US.It was because Jesus seemed not to be perfect in the sight of Jews that he was killed!BUT TO US JESUS Is PERFECT MASTER! Retrace your footsteps brother!
.BRO JOHN…ALL MANNER OF SIN AND BLASPHEMY SHALL BE FORGIVEN UNTO MEN:BUT THE BLASPHEMY AGAINST THE HOLY GHOST SHALL NOT BE FORGIVEN UNTO MEN.MATHEW 12:31…DEAR BRO TRACY:HAGIN AND COPELAND USED BIBLE AS PRETEXT FOR THEIR SERMONS,BUT JOSEPH SMITH WROTE A DIFFRENT BIBLE! DON’T MISLEAD PEOPLE OF GOD DUE TO INTRA MINISTRY DISAGREEMENT!..YE ARE gods! JOHN 10:30-35. “Whosoever shall offend these little ones”MATHEW18:6. I WAS HEALED OF A TWELVE YEAR OLD CANCER THROUGH REV HAGIN TEACHINGS! I STUMBLED ON WORD OF FAITH MAGAZINE SIX MONTHS TO MY GRAVE!
HEMY
Bro. Not everything that comes down the pike of religion ls wrong but remember it is the little foxes that spoils the vine. It may sound good, and tickle the flesh but will not pass the acid test. Today the enemy has imfortrated the church thru false doctrine. Instead of crying abba father the church is crying what can I get from you today. God help us.
.BRO JOHN…ALL MANNER OF SIN AND BLASPHEMY SHALL BE FORGIVEN UNTO MEN:BUT THE BLASPHEMY AGAINST THE HOLY GHOST SHALL NOT BE FORGIVEN UNTO MEN.MATHEW 12:31…DEAR BRO TRACY:HAGIN AND COPELAND USED BIBLE AS PRETEXT FOR THEIR SERMONS,BUT JOSEPH SMITH WROTE A DIFFRENT BIBLE! DON’T MISLEAD PEOPLE OF GOD DUE TO INTRA MINISTRY DISAGREEMENT!..YE ARE gods! JOHN 10:30-35. “Whosoever shall offend these little ones”MATHEW18:6. I WAS HEALED OF A TWELVE YEAR OLD CANCER THROUGH REV HAGIN TEACHINGS! I STUMBLED ON WORD OF FAITH MAGAZINE SIX MONTHS TO MY GRAVE!
Rev Joe in this particular scripture ye are gods Jesus was pertaining to was the judges who had the power over life and death so they were like gods but there is only one true god. You don’t build a whole doctrine on just one scripture. Jesus was god in the flesh. We are not.
Great post! Does anyone know the name of the CD on pride John listened to? I’d love to hear it.
I’m sorry for you, no one is perfect… from the very beginning of your history you don’t seem to have a good perspective on things as you pastor a church… you became bitter. May you have the right attitude now. Just continue pursuing God.
So other than your excuses on why not to believe what do YOU believe ?
Seems like your a h8ter and have no response
What bible college did you go to ?
amen…I. keep praying for my family that’s still in it….as I do for others. ..I see a what is it called. .. social club..pedigree. .pedicure. .nails. . hair..it scares me the question. ..Where is The Word of God preached?
I see little of it yet when I read the bible and or look within He is ever present .
This is utterly rediculous! and very misleading about “Word of Faith” teaching.
The saddest part about the Word-Faith Movement, I believe, is that it is exploiting so many people through their fear of poverty or through their greed, their fear of lack-of-control, their desire to “have an anointing” and “be someone,” and through their desire for excitement and “signs and wonders.” While this movement does teach partial truth and has some redeeming features, it offers only a milk-and-water or milk-and-sugar type of teaching that really cannot hold up under reality.
I’ve seen the train-wreck this type of belief-system can do when people finally give up and admit that it’s NOT working…or that it “works” only for certain teachers and pastors who receive donations. Some people leave the faith entirely over these teachings, never understanding that they were NOT being taught orthodox Christianity. Others get mad or even furious at the suggestion that Word-Faith isn’t real, but the Word of God stands firm. Even as some Renaissance-era Catholics were shocked at the extent of their unbiblical doctrine when they first read the Bible for themselves, a clear reading of the New Testament shows that:
1) Jesus was NOT materially wealthy. This was invented to justify certain teachers’ own greed.
2) In fact, Jesus & the authors of scripture condemned dependency on and pride in wealth. Early Christians (especially women) were NOT to flaunt their wealth in Church by wearing expensive clothing or jewelry. 1 Tim 2:9,
3) Early Christians were told to rejoice in suffering. They were willing to lose their lives, homes, possessions and reputations for the Gospel, and many did as do many Christians in other countries today
4) No one in the New Testament ever pleaded “the blood,” or ever gave “positive confession” that was in contrast to the literal truth. Instead, people in the Bible admitted failure, exhaustion, illness, and suffering. To give “positive confession” to something that is simply not true is at best deluding oneself and at worst, lying. We can always express our faith in God and our belief that he is working behind the scenes, but we don’t have to sugar-coat reality.
5) There is no evidence that early Church services involved chaos; in fact the opposite is true. One of the fruit of the Spirit is self-control. Even during services involving speaking in tongues, there was to be an interpreter and the person was in control of himself.
6)Sadly, while many in this movement shun any suggestion of “witchcraft,” this movement fosters superstition and fear. There is a huge fear of curses, of “witchcraft,” demons, and even (sometimes) of having a decorative item in the home that MIGHT have some type of curse or pagan name on it. When the early Christians met with demonic activity, they dealt with it and then went on. They did not live in fear of demons or curses.
7) Even worse, this movement blames the sick and injured for their condition, because they lack “faith” enough to be healed. Jesus NEVER did this, nor did the Apostles. Paul himself probably suffered a chronic eye problem, and other early Christians are recorded as getting sick. ALL of the early Christians eventually died…We are NOT guaranteed healing in ALL circumstances and illness is NOT a sign of a lack of faith, but at times is something God uses.
God is VERY real, and when you learn to believe in HIM and love HIM (rather than what He can do for you), you do not need constant excitement, constant signs and wonders, or material prosperity. Through the Holy Spirit, the true Christian will continue to trust God even in the face of suffering, persecution, or poverty. You look for a reward in heaven, not necessarily here on Earth. You accept the Will of God because you trust that God is wiser than you are and has a plan, and you don’t boast about your own plans. Like Christ, you say, “Not my will, but Thine be done.” These teachings are the true meat of Christianity.
Sister Apologia and those who believe Jesus was materially poor.
You must realize that the whole planet belongs to Him.
He had no treasures and He place no value on material things, but he had them.
He lived in a house!
9 When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was. 10 When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceeding great joy. 11 And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him:
He had wealth
and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; GOLD, and FRANKINCENSE, and MYRRH
Matt 2:9-12 (KJV)
He had a money bag, He carried expensive ointment and he gave to the poor.
3 Then took Mary a pound of ointment of spikenard, very costly, and anointed the feet of Jesus, and wiped his feet with her hair: and the house was filled with the odour of the ointment. 4 Then saith one of his disciples, Judas Iscariot, Simon’s son, which should betray him, 5 Why was not this ointment sold for three hundred pence, and given to the poor? 6 This he said, not that he cared for the poor; but because he was a thief, and had the bag, and bare what was put therein.
John 12:3-6 (KJV)
In the mouth of two witnesses his wealth is confirmed.
If you came down from here,
10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, 11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal; 12 And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: 13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates. 14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. 15 And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof. 16 And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal. 17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel. 18 And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass. 19 And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald; 20 The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst. 21 And the twelve gates were twelve pearls; every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass. 22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it. 23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
Rev 21:10-23 (KJV)
could earnestly consider yourself poor???? Well neither did Jesus.
Something Better Faith
Mark 11:24 – Therefore I say to you, all things for which you pray and ask, believe that you have received them, and they will be granted you.
One day I stood up in faith upon this immense, seemingly unsurpassable promise verse of Scripture to obtain the manifestation of the healing of my eyes from near sightedness so that I would no longer need glasses and so that I could give glory to God for the healing. Mark 11:24 is a promise verse from God that seems to be for anything and everything that we can possibly imagine to ask from Him because it clearly states that we will get “all things” that we ask God to give us and then believe that we have received them. All Things! Wow! This promise verse seems to be a huge, huge box that God has put Himself into for our sakes wherein He lets us loose to obtain anything and everything we desire!
Now one of the preachers whom I was listening to at that time even went so far as to say that we can write our own ticket with God using faith in this verse! Well, I did not believe that contention because to me such a contention comes from self, not from God, and I believe that we are to die to our self desires in order to be alive to God’s workings around and through us. But I had come to so much believe in this verse to manifest my healing (so that I could teach others to rely upon God and it for healing also) that by faith I threw away my glasses when by faaith I claimed it for the manifestation of the healing of my eyes.
However, my healing was not immediately manifested when I prayed and asked God for it. So, because I was still nearsighted, I could not yet see well enough without my glasses to do some things like safely drive my car. So in faith that my healing would manifest at any minute I began walking 3 miles a day as I went back and forth to and from my workplace, praising God. This was to the immense consternation of my unbelieving family. They berated me continuously during this period over this decision to pitch my glasses in faith that my healing would soon manifest. They all claimed that I had lost my mind and gone off the deep end on religion.
Isaiah 1:18a – Come now and let us reason together….
Now, after about 3 weeks of enduring my family’s ridicule and the apparent failure to receive the manifestation of the healing of my eyes, I believe that the Lord spoke into my heart about it. I believe that He spoke to me in thoughts that went something like this, “Jim, I want you to know that I am very pleased with your firm faith in Me and in this verse of Mine in regard to this healing miracle yo are requesting. I am also pleased that you have patiently suffered the devil’s rebukes through your unbelieving family for the sake of your faith in Me and My word. But I want you to think more deeply about this healing miracle for a moment.”
“Now, were I to manifest the healing of your eyes at this very minute, technically speaking, you would not actually be receiving the thing that you asked of Me according to Mark 11:24 because you asked Me for your healing to manifest 3 weeks ago. So if I manifested your healing right now, I still wouldn’t be giving you exactly the thing that you asked Me for! After all, you asked for it 3 weeks ago, not at some future time like right now.”
“So this promise verse did not come true for you as you expected that it would. You have not yet received the manifestation of your healing, even though this promise verse says that you should have received it because it is a “thing” that you believe has been granted to you. Therefore, I want you to begin to search the Scriptures to find out just why it did not occur exactly as you requested. I want you to do this because if you look deep into your heart you will find that you will never, ever be able to trust in any of my promise verses again until you can understand why your healing did not manifest just as you thought it would considering the fact that you have had unwavering faith that it would happen, trusting in the words of Mark 11:24!”
I perceived that this reasoning floating around in my mind was not devilish doubts but that it was good and true and therefore that it was from God. In spite of my great and terrible disappointment in the failure to occur of the manifestation of the healing of my eyes, I still fully believed that this promise verse of Mark 11:24 was true because I believe that God does not lie and all of His Word is true and that all of His promises are “Yes” and “Amen” in Jesus Christ.
So I began to feel that there must be some Scriptural “out” for God somewhere in the Bible from this seemingly all encompassing promise verse to us. I believed there had to be an “out” because I had not received the exact thing that I had asked for in faith and I had unwaveringly believed that it had been granted. To me God could not possibly be the culprit in this letdown and that I had been as firm in my faith as I could possibly be. So the failure had to somehow be in my own interpretation and / or my teachers’ interpretation of this wonderful promise verse in Mark.
After all, we are told to study for ourselves to rightly divide the Word of God and this promise verse says that all “things” that we ask for and then believe that we have already received, will be granted to us. The “manifestation of this healing at a certain time” which I prayed and believed for is certainly a “thing” is it not? I had believed for this “thing” with everything that I had in me and I truly believed that I actually already had been granted this “thing” from our Father God but it certainly had not manifested from Him exactly as I had asked of Him! I even went so far as to throw away my glasses and stand up firmly against ridicule from Satan through my family and my friends for weeks just so that I would not doubt God for this “thing” and yet this requested “thing” did not manifest!
Those ministers that I was listening to then claimed in their books that this kind of failure could only happen if one’s faith was weak or if one vacillated between faith and doubt or if one had wrong motives or if one had some other prayer hindrances but I truly could not find any of these mistakes within me. I admit that I did at first have some doubts about it but as I kept standing in faith for it, like Abraham, I grew strong and immovable as a bulldog in that faith.
Romans 4:19 – 21 – Without becoming weak in faith he contemplated his own body….yet, with respect to the promise of God, he did not waver in unbelief but grew strong in faith, giving glory to God, and being fully assured that what God had promised, He was able also to perform.
I fully believed that I had the manifestation of my healing coming to me from God based upon my absolutely firm faith in Mark 11:24 and I was just waiting for it to occur. But I had to admit that I had asked for it 3 weeks earlier and even if I got it right now, technically speaking I would not be getting that for which I had asked. This thought was beginning to shake up what until then had been my absolutely rock solid faith in the truth and reliability of every Bible passage! God had promised me in Mark 11:24 that I would get all “things” that I asked of Him but He didn’t give me this particular “thing” and now even if He did give it to me, it would not be exactly what I had asked Him for and had unwaveringly believed Him for!
Wow, was I in a pickle! Satan began using this “failure” for the miracle manifest to try to overthrow all of my faith in the Bible!
Luke 22:31 – ….Satan, by asking has obtained you….for himself and from My (Jesus) power into his, in order that he may shake you like a sieve, as grain is sifted, by an inward agitation, trying your faith to the very verge of overthrow. But as for Myself, I made petition concerning you that your faith should not be totally eclipsed. (Kenneth Wuest’s Expanded Translation of the New Testament)
Well, after the initial shock from this line of reasoning entering my mind I humbled myself to God and I began to do much immediate and intense Bible study. Thank God, He was faithful to rapidly lead me to my answer to this terrible dilemma. Of course, there it was right in plain sight, but hidden within a passage of Scripture that I had not yet noticed!
I believe that He moved to give me a revelation of the principle found in another promise verse, an overriding promise verse of Scripture that I now believe supercedes all of His other promise verses. Starting my Bible study I didn’t think it would be possible to find a greater promise verse than Mark 11:24 but there it was, where else but right in Hebrews 11, God’s Hall of Faith chapter.
Hebrews 11:39 – 40a – And all of these (aforementioned heroes of faith), though they won divine approval by [means of] their faith….
(THIS WAS ME ACCORDING TO THE THOUGHTS I FELT THAT I WAS GETTING FROM GOD),
….did not receive the fulfillment of what was promised….
(YEP, THIS WAS ME TOO!)
….because God had….something better and greater in view….(!!!!!!!)
Here we are told that Biblical believer’s who went through much greater struggles of faith against Satan then most of us ever have and then died in the process (!), would be eventually given better outcomes than the promises that they were hoping for and had faith for but did not actually receive here on earth before they died!
My revelation was that in this verse God puts Himself into a bigger box than He does in Mark 11:24! That bigger box is that THERE IS ONLY ONE REASON that He doesn’t give us exactly what He promises to give us in Mark 11:24 (if our motives are good and we are unwavering in our faith and nothing is hindering our prayers). That one reason is because He is going to eventually give us something SO MUCH BETTER than what He promises to give us in Mark 11:24 that we will never complain about it!
Ephesians 3:20 – Now to him who is able to do IMMEASURABLY MORE than all we can ask or imagine, according to His power that is at work within us
What a revelation that was to me! God showed me by revelation that this is His Scriptural “out” from the box which He seems to have put Himself into with His immense promise verse of Mark 11:24! His “out” from that one box of giving us any particular “thing” that we ask for is to put Himself into a much, much, much larger box that He is constantly improving upon our prayer and faith requests so that eventually, here or in heaven, He will give us much, much more than we could ever think of to ask of Him!
After all, will any of us complain to Him if we don’t get exactly what we asked for from Him if He ends up giving us some future “thing” or “things” which are so much better than we could think of to ask from Him? I sure won’t, that’s for sure!
Isaiah 55:8 – 9 – For My thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways My ways, says the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways HIGHER than your ways and My thoughts HIGHER than your thoughts.
So, as I see it now, whenever I make a faith prayer request to God and believe that I have received it, He grants it to me exactly as I have asked for it OR – OR – OR He replaces my faith prayer request with something better for me than I could ever think of to ask of Him! Never does He replace it with something less than what we ask for!
He does not tell me directly that He has replaced my request with something better because He tells it to me in the words and the principle of Hebrews 11:39 – 40. So I now believe that He never lets any of my prayers go unanswered even though it appears to me that He has not answered them because His answer is to not grant my exact request because He is instead replacing my request with something better than my request. He never, never, never grants me something less than my request!
It’s now been nearly 35 years since that particular faith trial and I am still wearing glasses and still believing every day for the manifestation of the healing of my eyes! I am still wearing glasses because I came to believe that God gave them to me as His provision by which for me to get by for now until He manifests the healing of my eyes here on earth (if He ever does). Consequently, I am looking forward to the much better thing(s) that He has in store for me perhaps here on earth but most certainly in heaven for diligently keeping this particular point of faith for all of these years!
There is one other thing that I feel that God wants me to mention here. Those ministers that do not understand this principle have been known to err by teaching people to have faith in Mark 11:24 for a loved one’s healing or even for their life but if that loved one is not healed and / or he or she passes on, they will then tell them that the reason that this promise verse failed them has to be because their faith in it had wavered or they had wrong motives or they had prayer hindrances! These ministers fall back to this untruth because they believe that God doesn’t lie so all that’s left that they can see to blame for the promise of Mark 11:24 not occurring is these people’s failures of faith. In effect they are telling those who lost that loved one that their doubts or failure to remove their prayer hindrances is what killed that loved one, which implies that they are murderers!
This is so wrong and it has turned many away from miracle faith. The truth of the matter is that God took that sick person as part of His “something better” plan for all concerned and the full wisdom and understanding of that death event is just too high and complicated for them to comprehend now but eventually it will turn out to be for the good of them all.
Romans 8:28 – And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose.
Eventually all of God’s “something betters” for us will be revealed to us by God, some maybe here on earth but most probably up in heaven. So for now, with the overarching replacement promise of Hebrews 11:39 – 40 in mind, we can walk away from the death of a loved one for whom we have had unwavering faith to be healed, sorrowful but at the same time still faithful, realizing that if our unwavering faith could have healed that loved one, it would have! But since it didn’t, we can have the joy of knowing that something better is surely waiting to manifest at some future time either here or up in heaven for all concerned. This will sustain us and comfort us in such an event!
__________________________________________________________________________
Dear Anita – Thank you for your positive response to the “something better” miracle faith teaching I sent you. I’m glad that it has given you peace of mind with God at the loss of your loved one and the unintentional but humiliating abuse you suffered from Satan through the faith teachers who did not understand this principle and falsely accused you of wavering in your faith.
This teaching has been a blessing to me for 30+ years and it has served to strengthen my faith in God immeasurably. May I just say that the major point of this teaching is that whatever appears to us to be a “No” answer from God is actually a “Yes”, but instead of granting us that which we have asked of Him, He is replacing our request with something so much better than we could have thought to ask of Him that we will never complain about it!” So His “No” is actually a “Yes” in disguise which fulfills –
2 Corinthians 1:20 – For as many as are the promises of God, in Him they are “Yes”; therefore also through Him is our “Amen” to the glory of God through us.
Therefore, if I stand in bold but humble faith upon a promise verse of God like Mark 11:24 and exactly what I ask of Him does not manifest, I believe that God did not say “No” to me. Instead I believe that instead He is saying, “Yes my dearly loved child! Yes! Yes! Yes! Thank you for honoring Me by asking for this “thing” from Me in Jesus name. But instead of giving it to you exactly as you requested it, I’m improving upon it with some thing or things which will be much, much better for you and Me and My Kingdom than you can possibly conceive of now. So you will never have grounds to complain to Me that I didn’t give you exactly what you wanted and had unwavering faith for when that better “thing” or those better “things” with which I have determined will improve upon your request, finally manifest to you!”
This is the underlying principle of –
Hebrews 11:39 – 40a – And all these, having gained approval (from God) through their faith, did not receive what was promised because God had provided something better for us….
When I got a hold of this concept I realized that if my motives are right and if I’m not doing anything to hinder my prayers and if I’m humble before the Lord, and if I’m unwavering in my faith, He does not say “No” to any of my requests because those requests or better “things” for me become His will for my life here on earth and / or in the next world. This is what now strengthens my faith and what I try to pass on to others. May God richly bless you in all of your future “something betters” too.
1 Corinthians 2:9 – ….as the Scripture says, What eye has not seen and ear has not heard and what has not entered into the heart of man, [all that] God has prepared (made and keeps ready) for those who love Him [who hold Him in affectionate reverence, promptly obeying Him and gratefully recognizing the benefits He has bestowed].
Jeremiah 29:11 – For I know the thoughts and the plans that I have for you, says the Lord, thoughts and plans for your welfare and your peace and not for evil, to give you hope in your final outcome.
Romans 8:28 – And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose.
Whenever you find yourself with a banana that’s getting a little too ripe,
peel it, and then slice it. You Simply Have to Start Drinking
Healthy Smoothies. 1 ripe banana 1 tablespoon of honey (not for children
under 1).
Man I think your have demons.there is nothing wrong with Word of faith leaders
Its umbilical, .Occult in nature. leads people to embrace a false gospel. One that leads people not to Jesus but themselves. Only people who get rich are the ones who fleece the flock.
I know everyone is entitled to their opinion and that some have been hurt by Word of Faith but just for a second look at what you are saying and doing on this website 🙂 It’s exactly actions like this that are causing a decline of the church in Western culture. The world is divisive enough without current and ex-Christians pulling it down from the inside. The world can see there is no unity because we are behaving just like them so they don’t want any part of it.
If we claim to have Jesus as our Lord and Saviour we should test the word preached to us but sites like this are part of the problem not the solution. Any body can sit behind a computer and criticise, it doesn’t take much faith to tear people down. I would be sooooooooooooooo much more impressed if any of you were studying the word and sharing it the way you believe God is ministering to you, the way you obviously believe these people are lacking. Instead of complaining, be the change you believe God is calling you to be.
Heresy will send a man and women to hell faster than the truth. At least the truth will steer him in the right direction. The Word of faith is a heretical teachings which cannot save and cannot offer real and everlasting hope.
I suggest you spend your time studying scripture and get to know the real Jesus.
I do spend time studying the word and praying and praising and worshiping my Lord and Saviour so don’t assume my comment is made out of ignorance.
Jesus and the disciples were considered heretics in their time because they preached that God the Father wants an intimate relationship with every one of His creations. This was unthinkable for the Jews of Jesus’ time as they had always known God to be distant and only communicating through the priests and prophets. Any teacher of the word will receive stricter judgement by The Lord (James 3:1) for what they communicate in His name and as far as I am aware it is not up to us to judge the actions and words of other because we are not God. Matthew 7:1-2 says “Judge not, that you not be judged. For with what judgement you judge, you will be judge; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you”, clearly judging others does as much or more harm to us as it does to others because we can only judge in the natural however God’s judgements are eternal therefore what we say about others and do with our time has eternal repercussions. In light of Matthew 7:4-5 I ask you to look at the plank in your own eye because choosing to be critical of others is not loving as seen in 1 Corinthians 13:4-7. When Jesus says that the greatest commandment is to love God with all our heart, mind and soul and out of that love, love others as we love ourselves. Whether or not the other person is wrong in their belief, it ultimately up to God to change them because we as humans are more likely to cause offense.
As far as I am aware, it is not asking Jesus into our heart to be Lord and Saviour of our life that sends a person to hell not heresy. People are imperfect and even with Jesus we are prone to sin so if people are misguided but have asked Jesus into their heart to be their Lord and Saviour they will be saved.
I understand that not all teachings are beneficial to the hearer and that imperfect people have made mistakes in the name of God and Jesus but we are not called to judge others, it does more harm that good.
Alice you need to take your own advice. Your comments are just as critical, divisive, and unhelpful as you accuse others comments of being! What you continue to not understand here is that this particular DIVISION is entirely necessary. There is a division between the sheep and the goats, and there always will be. What John Edwards has written is meant as to warn the SHEEP, not the goats about the wolf who is coming to devour. The sheep will listen, eventually. The goats, on the other hand, will continue to cry foul as you are doing.
My goodness, I thought this was dealt with months ago. Please, dear God, read my last comment to the saga we had last time. This will be the last time I comment here and I beg you to please refrain from making any more comments after this because I would be so much more peaceful without the venom of hatred and bitterness spouted on this site coursing through my life again. My body is dealing with enough illness without adding the ailments caused by bitterness. In spite of the latest tirade, I refuse to let you steal my joy and peace. I’m going to take my own advice and not return to this site like a dog to its own vomit.
I remind you to say what you must in love because people will switch off, not listen and think you are crazy if you attack them like this. I’m not saying that the content of this site is wrong and I am not defending the actions of people involved in Word of Faith, clearly they have wronged a number of people and God will exact His justice on them in due course. But the world will know us by the love we have for our brothers, no matter how misguided they are. There is no fruit of the Spirit here; no kindness, gentleness, self control, let alone love, joy or peace. People will always be receptive to love, grace, compassion and mercy. And before you launch into a tirade about how people will think that grace is a free licence to live however they want because God will forgive them anyway, the bible says grace is God’s empowerment for us to live the holy life He has called us to because we cannot do it in our own strength. Have some faith that although people are no perfect we worship a God who is and He will complete the good work He has begun in each one of us.
For Alice:
You answered awfully quickly before. If it’s the last word you want, I promise, I will let you have the last word. I”m sorry the truth has disturbed your bliss. Actually this is exactly what happened to John Edward. He didn’t want to hear it either, at first, but then he allowed his eyes to be opened. Will you do that too? The truth is hard to hear, but only those who have received the love of truth will hear it. As of right now, it seems you don’t love the truth. But you can change. Please quit opposing those who want to warn others who and where the wolf is. Peace at any cost is not what the gospel teaches.
I’ve posted here before a while back and just got a new email from someone defending Word of Faith or WOF. Let’s make it more accurate….Word of Living Faith, or WOLF! John Edwards, you are 100% dead on accurate in all your assessments of regarding WOLF. Unfortunately only the people who REALLY want to know the truth will ever figure it out. The rest will continue on their path toward hell. I cut my first tooth in a “faith” church. It took me 6 years there to figure out what was wrong and to leave that church.
The latest email notification came from someone defending WOLF. She or he said it’s wrong to criticize. She missed the whole point. John is not being critical of WOLF. He is DISCERNING the difference between good and evil. And Word of Faith is EVIL. We should always be on the lookout for those who would sell us up the river for their own gain and blame it on God somehow. She also said all you have to do is “ask Jesus into your heart”. That is unsound and unscriptural. Nowhere will you find that in the bible. Jesus said you must pick up your cross and follow Him…tip the end of your life and die faithful to Him. THAT is simple. But it’s the hardest thing any human being will ever do.
Those who blindly think that just praying the sinners prayer is enough will be horribly surprised upon their deaths.
That’s just like making an appointment with the dentist for rotten teeth, but never showing up for the appointments nor submitting to his treatment plan. You can tell others your dentist saved your teeth, but they will see your teeth are still rotten. There HAS to be evidence!! You will know them by their FRUIT!
I’m definitely a she, so next time there’s not need for “she or he” remarks. I’m not defending Word of Living Faith, I have attended churches that were not part of the Word of Living Faith movement which preached similar messages and as a result more harm was done than good; however it doesn’t give me the right to “discern” the mistakes of these preachers and enlighten others about their flaws.
You assume it is the job of Christians to change people’s understanding of God and His word, it is not. You may change people’s perceptions only for a while but the only being that can bring lasting change is the Holy Spirit working in an individual’s life; Acts 5:38 says “And now I say to you, keep away from these men and let them alone; for if this plan or this work is of men, it will come to nothing”. If these churches are preaching half-truths or blatant lies, God will deal with them. Again I will reiterate Matthew 7:1-2 by the same measure that you judge it will be measured back to you. This is further supported in Galatians 5:14-15 which says “for all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this’You shall love you neighbour as yourself.’ But if you bite and devour one another, beware lest you be consumed by one another.” We are called to bear with one another in love (Ephesians 4:1-3), even if they are misguided. I agree that if Jesus is our Lord and Saviour there will be fruit, but Jesus Himself said that the world will know we are His disciples by the love we have for one another (John 13:25) and there is nothing loving about this site just reasons why people won’t join the church. Non-Christians are very observant, they there is no unity because we are attacking each other for differences in theology which makes us just like them, they don’t want to join the church because from the outside they see we are no different. On top of this, if the discernments of this site were truly from God the fruits of the Spirit would be present and they are not. There is no love, joy or peace let alone gentleness, self-control, kindness, long-suffering/patience.
Ephesians 4:4-6 says “there is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.” Inspired by God Paul writes that we are all one body, so why is the one body tearing itself apart from the inside? Have any of you seen a disease that destroys the body from the inside? Cancer and autoimmune conditions are only a couple but it only takes a few cells or an external stimuli to be introduced to cause the body to deteriorate either through uncontrolled growth of toxic mutations or because the body is attacking itself. I have Hashimoto’s Thyroiditis, a medically incurable autoimmune condition where the immune system attacks the thyroid. Thankfully mine was caught early but I struggle to lose weight, I will forever have a goitre and if I ever try to fall pregnant I will have to be watched closely by a team of medical professionals to ensure that I develop a healthy foetus and do not spontaneously miscarry. If this condition is left untreated it destroys the body’s metabolic system so you gain weight and retain water, you are in a permant lethargic state and if you are a woman you can be left infertile or unable to carry a child to full term. This is the sort of thing that we are doing by attacking one another rather than the real enemy. An army that attacks itself has no power and is rightly a source of ridicule because they look ridiculous.
It is quite obvious that many of you have been wrong by Word of Living Faith ministries, I understand what that feels like. In the time I have been at my church we have seen multiple leadership hand overs, huge debts we are only just paying off due to financial mismanagement and sexual immorality that tore the church apart. We now have a pastor who is not only strong as a leader and father figure to the church but also a man who imparts sound biblical doctrine and is teaching me to study the word. I have also been hurt by family members in authority over me, even though I grew up in a Christian family who taught me good values I was abused sexually as a child and young adult by an older relative of my father. I have been hurt in so many ways it is not funny but I have learnt that bitterness breeds bitterness and hurting people hurt people. To be quite honest, for the longest time my words and actions were so toxic that I don’t blame anybody any more for not wanting to be around me.
I know you probably think Revelations is completely metaphoric but Revelations 3:20 says “Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me.” Inviting Jesus to be our Lord and Saviour means letting Him into our heart, the part of our being from which His grace spills out into the rest of our lives and from out of the overflow we speak. If Jesus does not have control of our heart He does not have control of us at all because our heart will always rule over our head. Any one can have head knowledge of Jesus and still not be saved, it’s believing the head knowledge in the innermost parts of your being and allowing Jesus to rule over your life that results in salvation. You can pick up your cross all you want but without Jesus ruling in and over your heart, you will struggle in your own strength until the day you die, kinda like the people misled by unbiblical teachings.
Again, only those who are sheep will heed the voice of the Shepherd. We won’t listen to a stranger. Word of Faith is the message of the wolf, no matter who preaches it. Go back and re-read John Edwards point by point discernment of Word of Faith. There is a HUGE difference between discernment of good/evil and just being critical for no good reason. Lose your pride. There is no he or she in Christ.
Again, only those who are sheep will heed the voice of the Shepherd. We won’t listen to a stranger. Word of Faith is the message of the wolf, no matter who preaches it. Go back and re-read John Edwards point by point discernment of Word of Faith. There is a HUGE difference between discernment of good/evil and just being critical for no good reason. Lose your pride. There is no he or she in Christ.
Do you know why Christ’s followers are called sheep and He the Shepherd? Sheep are well known to be the dumbest animals on God’s green earth. They are so stupid that without the Shepherd’s care they will cause themselves harm or quickly die because left to their own devices they do not know when they are in danger or how to take care of themselves. Maybe you’d be surprised at how often we listen to strangers, in this day and age many people don’t test the word preached to them and quite often we are left with half-truths preached in the church. I actually applaud you all for not taking the teachings you have received at face value and testing the word. It helps us to recognise unbiblical teachings. The bible says that all of those who call Jesus Christ their Lord and Saviour are His sheep. It is unfortunate that ministries like Word of Faith are only teaching what the sheep want to hear and not the whole truth of God but if you listen to something for long enough you begin to believe it and follow it. It’s like listening to certain types of music make you feel happy on the inside when you listen to them others make you sad. Same goes for your emotions, if you focus on on anger after a while you will be angry or if you focus on something negative someone said you will begin to believe it as truth. If we listen to the wrong things for too long over time we are unable to hear what Jesus is saying because we don’t recognise His voice any more.
Again, I’m not saying that John is wrong nor have I ever, his views on this website appear to be completely accurate. I will always take issue with the attitude in which it’s brought to the masses. However accurate his discernments may be there is still a right way and a wrong way to go about it and putting it in a public forum where other people who have been hurt by the same ministry can feel justified in their pain and animosity towards the ministry is not the way to do it. There is also a difference between discernments and observations. If you study the Word regularly and ask God for wisdom He will always show us the truth and draw us closer to Him. I said it before, if the discernments on this site were truly Godly then the fruits of the Spirit would be apparent and they are not. There is nothing loving, peaceful or joyful about this site and I fail to see the kindness, gentleness, patience and self-control in much of what is said. I’m not sure about anybody else but the more I read the posts on this site the more I feel agitated and uncomfortable. I understand being hurt by people inside and outside of the church, I’m still forgiving people who made my life hell over the years but after God has set me free from a lot of the hurt, shame and guilt in my past, I never want to go back to the hatred and bitterness I lived in before. Now that you are free from the teachings of Word of Faith there is need to keep a hold of the hurt they caused you, ask God to take it from you. In no way am I saying that anyone should forget that the teachings of Word of Faith are misguided but if Jesus is truly sovereign in your lives then you do need to forgive others for the damage they caused. To deny others forgiveness is to forget how much you have been forgiven from.
Galatians 3:26-29 was an interesting verse to use 🙂 I completely agree with the line of thought you were following, it is true that there is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for we are all one in Christ Jesus. However, I’m not sure about anybody else but when I accepted Jesus as my Lord and Saviour I didn’t suddenly become asexual or a hermaphrodite. In the natural I am very much still a woman and as such I have a vital role to play in the body of Christ. Is it pride to be thankful and appreciate the gender God made me? Would you get offended if I called you a man? Genesis 1:26-28 says that man and woman were created in God’s image and therefore He has a plan and a purpose for both genders. He also called both male and female creations good, so who am I to deny what The Lord called good.
Perhaps the reason why you have trouble receiving what John is saying is not because of how he is saying but the way in which you are receiving it. You are very defensive. You have misunderstood, misinterpreted, and misquoted what I was saying yet in the course of your letter you agreed with me somewhat. You also wrongly assumed I was being snide by calling you he or she when I wasn’t. Actually it’s quite the opposite. When I first got notification of your response on my mobile phone, I was not at home. Later I could not find your letter when I opened this site on my computer so I had to make general comments to he or she, not wanting to offend gender-wise, yet to specifically address the WOLF in the body of Christ. (To remain silent when I see the wolf is coming is to have wanton unconcern for others. I can’t do that! I must speak out! I’ve been greatly harmed by WOLF and I DON”T want this to happen to others!!! ) Yet you opened your response to me in a very defensive way which was totally unnecessary. If you still want to see John’s righteous and Godly warning as unjust criticism, then I suspect that your pride is keeping you from seeing the truth. But I must speak out against WOLF. Regardless who I offend. My intent is to save others from the harm it causes. Bottom line is the truth IS offensive to those who DO NOT WANT TO KNOW IT!
As a nurse, sometimes CPR is necessary to save a patient’s life. I’ve broken ribs before. It’s a horrible feeling when you feel bones break – and hear them snap – under your hands in the very effort you are making to save the life of another. Yet it HAS to be done. Better to be alive with broken bones, than dead with every bone intact.
Funny what happens when people argue about the same side of a coin. I admire your passion, it’s a quality I pray you have in every area of your life.
Word to the wise, if you speak to people in real life about Word of Faith ministries like you do on here, people will switch off and not listen. Say what you must in love and be the teacher that others failed to be in your world. Share God’s love and grace with everyone and let Him make the everlasting changes in them.
Very interesting and got me thinking. I have a wonderful older friend gentlemen that is word of faith. He loves God with all his heart and is staunch word of faith but something in his walk does not portray love. It has really got me thinking. Your words have got me thinking. What I want to know is why you say they do not believe in the blood of Jesus. So are you saying they so emphasize the word of faith so as to bring the blood of Jesus of no account? There could be something here but could you clarify? I am quite sure they would say they believe in the blood of Jesus. There is the gift of Faith. And the word of faith does heal the sick if they come before the elders for prayer so there is an element of truth. So there is grounds for what they believe. I will study this more in depth to find out where the error is but this thing of pride I think is very true. Whenever you think you are special because you are operating in faith you have moved out of dependence on Jesus and his finished work on the cross. That is where the healing miracles provision is. He came to set us free. I would that you would be in health and prosper even as your soul prospers. This is based solidly on what Jesus did for us on the cross. Even in the old covenant there is a type of the cross. When they put the serpent on the pole everyone that looked to the serpent was healed. All we have to do is look to Jesus. The gospel is too easy. We miss it sometimes. It is all what he did and we have access to it because we are united with him. That is the new covenant.
wow guys i have really enjoyed reading your posts. i only wish to add that i hate religion and you find it everywhere. i am pentecostal so i don’t fit in with the baptists or methodist or anyone else. i don’t believe i am any better than them but i just can’t stand to hear people blame god for everything. i was a member of a word of faith church and am still bleeding from the wounds inflicted on me and my family by the pastor who was the cruelist man in the world. i love God i love the Word and i am totally a Jesus freak. i love Kenneth E. Hagin and i have studied his books since i was 15. i am now 52 so that has been a few years. he was a loving man, but the people who come out of Rhema are dictators and hard on people. Jesus loved the sheep and gave His life for the church. i wish some of the word of faith preachers would just try to be like Jesus and stop trying to be another Kenneth Hagin or Smith Wigglesworth. You aint them! Just love the people God gave you, stick to the Word and stop abusing your flock. I personaly don’t go to church anymore because the bad far out weighed the good. At least at home i can turn the channel if the preacher gets off the Bible and i can give as the Lord directs me to do so without fear that God will burn my house or tear up my car if i don’t.
I was set free from abundant life Christian center in La Marque tx. I was fooled and controlled by Walter hallam. There are unclean spirits at alcc that imitate the Holy Spirit. I joined church after radical transformation. The fruit of the 3rd generation of positive confession preachers is the most rotten. Haggin being the first generation of deception.
In my view…the first rebellion was Satan who Named that he want to be the most high God…then he claimed it with the deception of Adam and eve.
Yes the prosperity preachers have some truth in their teachings but the root of the movement is satanic.
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I have a relative that is in a similar situation. I am interested in what CD it was that made you stop and think?
David Hunt’s ‘Seduction of Christianity’ nd beyond seduction (admin)
Mr. Edwards,
I was extremely saddened to read your article regarding the Faith Message. However, that same premiere educational facility eternally changed every aspect of my life regarding my professional pursuits of leading city and county governments, personal and governmental finances, family health and yes, 24 years standing on the Promise’s that our daughter would be delivered from drug addiction. As a result, our daughter’s heart was healed and set free Christmas Day 2014. Professionally, I have every reason in the world to through in the towel…BUT GOD! My wife and I had every reason in the world to abandon 46 years of marriage…BUT GOD! So what’s the difference… I learned early on two valuable lessons about my Savior…He never quit! Secondly, Philemon 4-6 taught me early on the “Effective Faith” manifest when I have revelation knowledge of the Godhead within which originates from the Father transforming and energizing me and others in my sphere of influence. Third, I can name it and claim it until the cows return but until I have renewed the spirit of my mind Eph 4:24 and I have revelation knowledge of His word Eph 1:17-23, then it is not manifesting from the heart, but from the head. Jesus in His pain and agony never through in the towel and neither will I forfeit the precious promises that we have lived out for 46 years! The Word of God has only one requirement…ONLY BELIEVE! Not going to stop now, sorry you have made the decision to spend your days proving it did not, dies not and will not work. I choose to press toward the goal, achieving my destiny God has prepared for me and my household.
To: Huey P. Long:
In response to your post I have copied below, you said:
Mr. Edwards,
I was extremely saddened to read your article regarding the Faith Message. However, that same premiere educational facility eternally changed every aspect of my life regarding my professional pursuits of leading city and county governments, personal and governmental finances, family health and yes, 24 years standing on the Promise’s that our daughter would be delivered from drug addiction. As a result, our daughter’s heart was healed and set free Christmas Day 2014. Professionally, I have every reason in the world to through in the towel…BUT GOD! My wife and I had every reason in the world to abandon 46 years of marriage…BUT GOD! So what’s the difference… I learned early on two valuable lessons about my Savior…He never quit! Secondly, Philemon 4-6 taught me early on the “Effective Faith” manifest when I have revelation knowledge of the Godhead within which originates from the Father transforming and energizing me and others in my sphere of influence. Third, I can name it and claim it until the cows return but until I have renewed the spirit of my mind Eph 4:24 and I have revelation knowledge of His word Eph 1:17-23, then it is not manifesting from the heart, but from the head. Jesus in His pain and agony never through in the towel and neither will I forfeit the precious promises that we have lived out for 46 years! The Word of God has only one requirement…ONLY BELIEVE! Not going to stop now, sorry you have made the decision to spend your days proving it did not, dies not and will not work. I choose to press toward the goal, achieving my destiny God has prepared for me and my household.
My response:
Why not listen to the teaching that John Edwards listened to that changed his direction and see what it is he is referring to? Do a word search for Dave Hunt and pride. What do you have to lose?
Hi UC Ministries,
Would you please restate for all of us the title/author of the teaching John Edwards listened to that opened his eyes to the truth? Thank you!
I learnt to put trust in God and not in my own strength but still yet “In Faith” Jesus is my strength. therefore when I believed in God my maker I should also believe in myself as his made.
Paul said,” I can do all thing true him who strengthen me” He believed in God’s power to be demonstrate by him / through him.
Pls. I will like if you could ask God for more divine intervention to open the door of your hearth so that you can know and be able to interpret His word very well.
Wow…this guy is right on! I have no problem naming names. creator of evil is E W kenyan. Then we move to first tier, Kenneth Hagin. The second tier is the likes of Kenneth Copeland. Now let’s go the Kenneth’s children. Jesse duplantis, Creflo dollar and a few others.
This evil spirit got into the spiritual realm of Oral Roberts… We got lots of sons here. Joyce Meyer, Walter Hallam and 100’s more.
I consider Jesse Duplantis and his company to be third generation.
I have seen the destruction of the fourth generation. Myself and others were being prepped by Satan to be a mouth piece to start a new generation. Jesus saved me from this cult of personality!
I believe the problem you had (Author) was putting too much emphasis on what you were taught. Anything that is good can easily be bad if you go to the extreme. Everything that I’ve been taught by Kenneth Hagin has been true in my life. Everything! God’s word says to seek His kingdom and everything will be added to you. You said yourself you were only concerned about you. You also said you hated being a preacher. Did you ever stop to think that God didn’t call you to be a preacher. Many people who are not in the will of God will face many bad things. You were either called and were not faithful, or you were not called at all. My church teaches what kenneth hagin taught and my church is blessed. Moving up. My church also teaches the word of God and is lead by the spirit! That is something you seemed to lack. You focused on yourself! Kenneth hagin preached about prosperity, and walking in love, he also preached about being human and falling short! He never encouraged anyone to go to the extreme with anything he taught. Some are here to preach faith, some are here to exhort, some are here to teach grace, some are to teach prosperity! But all preach the word of God. I’m sorry for everything that happened to you, but you went to the extreme and those people who taught faith are not responsible for your actions.
People post and then like run.. you never get to talk to them..
I learned years ago when you hear me me me or I I I then you know who is talking. I am not Gods police and I will not say negitive things about other believers. We are one body.. you believe in healing tongues prosperity praise GOD. You dont believe in healing in tongues or prosperity praise GOD. Who do you think the BODY is?
I have been reading and have for awhile now at so many so called Christians talking hurting Word Of Faith. In searching thoses that say they are the true believers ..look for the words “prayer, forgiveness, mercy,grace” You are shown all these and look how you show it others
Are you sure your saved? No ..really. Look how they talk….I mean I sin more then most and yet ..what am I better? NO! But I dont care if your Baptist to Word Of Faith ..if you miss it I will be there If you fall I will catch you.. I will not give up on you. He does not me so how can I do any less for ALL? He told me to LOVE one another to love my enemys ..man go look up LOVE.. tell me you did all that to WORD OF FAITH..
No they say.. they are not off God they preach an other gospel so THAT = I CAN SAY WHAT EVER I WANT about them! I can judge them..duh it says it.. I can condemn them..granted no condemnation to them in Christ Jesus.. I LOVE WORD OF FAITH! I LOVE BAPTIST! I can listen to both and get so blessed. Yet I just dont agree with everything they say..
You know what I HAVE to know? I cant save anyone. I cant MAKE anyone love each other. I can beg and cry at there feet and they will not listen. lol and I dont stop.. Then you hear Jesus tell you.. my child..if they wont listen to me..they will not listen to you.. HAHA I am calling Him a liar.. I forget He can not.. Christians can be so awful so mean…
To just love the one you hate.. to look past all the sin all the garbage.. you see the real person. Yes there is a price..
frankie says:…
Brother/sister thank you for that. Though I never say anything bad about Copeland or the like or anyone I pray.. I never new that. You are so right people NEVER post what he says now
Thank you for your honesty Rev. John Edwards. My wife and I are missionaries here in Kenya. The sad thing is that this this destructive heresy has com to Africa where the hirelings are fleecing the flock…both here and from abroad. Truly we are seeing that time that the apostle Paul described that God Himself would send a “strong delusion.”
Craig
My thought is this… that the Word of Faith preaching is a “hook” that is very deceptive. Because everything they “promise” if you “do it yourself”… really, God does really promise. Except God says to honor and worship Him before Him humbly in reverent fear of God (not a slavish fear but a true honor and worship that stoops low before Him in humility)… and in personal relationship… He will provide, He will protect, He will bless, He will heal, He will prosper… and everything the Word of Faith “promises”. The “hook” is that all the promises are true. However, one must truly honor God as King and Ruler and Sovereign… or one is “doing it yourself” rather than God doing all He can do in and through us as saints. I believe all the promises of God. That’s their “hook”. Those promises are in the Bible and they are all true. It’s just not a “do it yourself” New Age gnostic religion. It’s a religion of personal relationship with God through humble submission towards God honoring and worshipping God as God… so He does all He can do in and through us as we are bowed low before Him… and He lifts us up… rather than us exalting ourselves “doing it ourselves”. Amen.
Many of these Word of Faith preachers… are not and never have been… saved. Some of them are satanists… and Jesuit infiltrators. The devil has always promised to his followers… that only God can provide. The devil always has said, “do it yourself”… and God always said, “Follow me… walk with me… worship me alone… walk humbly with me and love mercy”.
The devil has always been so deceptive.
And for those of us who do know and believe all God’s promises are true… it’s truly sad that the Word of Faith false teachers are the ones who most loudly state the promises of God… and then leave the Word of God and say, “do it yourself with your own words and your own faith”. That’s truly New Age and satanism.
So, may God Himself manifest the truth and power of His Word as we do it HIS WAY… as HE DOES IT in and through us… as we WORSHIP HIM IN SUBMISSION AND HUMILITY AND TRUST IN HIM ALSO TO BRING HIS WORD TO PASS. Amen.
Pastor be encouraged. I wanted to let you know that I agree with every word you said and the words you didn’t have time to say…. I am an ex member of WORD OF FAITH INTERNATIONAL CHRISTIAN CENTER IN SOUTHFIELD MICHIGAN. I was a member for many years and attended their BIBLE TRAINING CENTER FOR TWO YEARS. I was there until 1999 until the Holy Spirit told me to leave. My children also attended their school FAITH CHRISTIAN ACADEMY for years since K4…. I can’t begin to tell you about all the deception and cult like spirits there are. THANKS FOR YOUR TESTIMONY. I THOUGHT I WAS THE ONLY ONE WHO KNEW and who had experienced that…… its so much I want to say but as the word of God says ….if you go into a place and they don’t receive you, SHAKE THE DUST OFF YOUR FEET AND LEAVE…. AS A TESTOMONY AGAINST THEM. Sincerely.
I thank God for the life of Pastor Ediward.
I understand that if someone sees that the thing is not working we always push a blame on some one.
Our father Adam did the same thing.
And our dear pastor mentality was full centered on word of faith as ministry. Not Word of Faith as scriptual (John 6:63)
But it is not for me to Judge why your destroying the very same work of God your doing.
Why did you ask God first to instruct you which church to join before becoming a minister in Kenneth Hagens ministry?
Proverbs 6:19b.
May our Good God have mercy on you sir.
John, I stand behind you 100%. I like you was once caught in the trap and was a Word Faither until God delivered me out of it. As one wise man once said, “evil triumphs where good men stay quiet” – or words to that effect. The Lord has called us all to be a light in a dark place; and at times that dark place is the church itself. It is our duty to stand for Christ and even exposing the counterfeit. I believe that the Word Faith movement is a contemporary Gnostic religion. it is a very different religion to Christianity with it’s different god(s), different gospel, etc. To love these people is to point to their heretical doctrines, it’s the hirelings who run away and leave the sheep for the bears and wolves.
The trouble is, there is a price to pay for standing for the Truth and that is scars placed on us by well-meaning so-called Christians who hate the Truth being revealed and light being shed on the false-teachers and the heresies.
Jesus and his disciples were not rich 1 Cor 4:11 .The bible clearly tell us that Jesus was poor on earth and has make us spiritually rich 2 Cor 8:9 .if Jesus was rich why did Judas betrayed him for 30 pieces of silver ?
Why did Peter say silver and gold have i none ?
How can someone born in a manager buried in a tomb provided by a non family member as a rich man ?
So Jesus was rich wearing beautiful clothes and he decided not share with John the baptist were sackcloth ?
Didnt Jesus say it is easy for a camel to go through the eye of the needle than for a rich man to go hell ?
If Jesus was rich he wouldnt have made such a statement ?
Why did Jesus say u cannot serve God and mammon ?
History tells that the majority of christian in thebdays of Peter and paul were poor and persecuted.Most of them Died as marthys.
Those who say the teaching of kenneth hagin has worked it my prayer that God ll open their eyes to know that kenneth hagin is a false Apostle Prophet and Teacher . Do u know that that these fake preachers wear reading glasses why dont they practice what they preach ?
I am so sorry about your daughter. It must have been heartbreaking. You are right about Job. This book was written to clearly indicate that bad things can happen to good people no matter how much they claim promises. On the other hand I have learnt that speaking out the word increases faith, but like you correctly warned, we can over balance and begin to believe everything will be handed to us on a plate.
May God bless you as you continue your walk with him, seeking his face like you are doing, which is more profitable than seeking his hand. Thanks for your article.
I have been around this for a long time. I once ushered a service for a major, US nationally know couple with a well-known healing ministry. They attended Osteens Church, published many books and sold tapes and books at their big meetings all over.
It was an eye-opener to me when the husband in the team told us ushers that “you will be up close and personal, and see many things that you know are manipulations and not true. Please understand that this is necessary to build the faih of the crowd, because they will not receive unless they believe, and if we do not create the impression that something is happening they will not respond.” I watched as he called up people with “knee problems” and lined up a couple of dozen of them, had them face the crowd, and with a big shout ran behind them hitting them in the back of the knees. They all fell down….DUH!!!!
He then went on to declare the mighty hand of God. Many people with unseen ailments were declared healed. No one with obvious deformities were even allowed to come for prayer.
Apparently, lying to God’s people to stimulate “faith” is accepted practice. But the miracles really do not measure up to the hype.
You have to admit, though, it sells a lot of books.
I had rather hoped that this was an aberration, a couple of “bad apples,” but, alas, in my search over the many years I observe that this is the rule, not the exception.
They come to town, tell you about all the great things God did somewhere else, tell you the grand vision that God has given them for going to some exotic place with this wonderful message, collect the hugest offering they possibly can by promising astounding hundred-fold returns, push over some people, blow on some people, possible grown out a leg or two (usually on people have had the same procedure by 50 faith preachers before – apparently God’s “miracles” don’t have a lot of stamina with this crowd…and leave with the money and the glory, leaving the pastor behind to explain to all the people who were “healed” why they are still sick.
If you defend this garbage, then you have had a deep drink of the kool-aid or are just as big a deceiver as each one of this lot is.
My heart cries for you, for you will have a lot to answer for before God.
Keep getting new email notifications here lately that are really really good, but for some reason I cannot find them on this page! Why not??
I just wanted to add this: The reason why Word of Faith is evil and those who propagate its message are NOT brothers and sisters in Christ, they are agents of the devil, is the crux of the message. Word of faith’s central message is “let MY will be done”. Christianity, on the other hand, says “let THY will be done”. The two are diametrically opposed. Word of faith is no more Christian than Islam or Buddhism or any other religion, nor can it be! Word of faith employs all kinds of religious trickery and fake devoutness to keep from being exposed. They may hold up the bible and speak highly of it and even quote directly from it. Even teach sermons loosely based on certain scriptures that speak of being gods or getting what they want. Yet the central message is let my will be done. Their hearts are unchanged and they remain in their pride and their sins. They are using God to get stuff. They will fight tooth and toenail and say this is not so, but it is. I know this from the inside, not as a casual observer, but as a victim who got free from its clutches.
We must be careful of criticism, because God has not called you to preach the word of Faith and by virtue of that, you have little insight into it, doesn’t make any revelation in that direction wrong and Anti-God idea. Because God has not called you to preach the Holiness Message, doesn’t make it a wrong message. The Gospel of The kingdom is complete.
A little here and a little there,
Precept upon precept, line upon lines, until we all come to the fullness of the status of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Celebrate your message and keep preaching it.
God has not called ANYONE to preach any other message than the gospel. Paul sure had no problem being critical of anyone who preached a false gospel, such as word of faith. He condemned those who did.
We are to MARK those who teach a different gospel and teach things contrary to God’s Word and AVOID them (Word Faith teachers, etc). “Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them ” (Rom. 16:17).
Hi, my name is Rey Trevino and I’m not one of your most demonstrative of believers but I have a deep faith in Jesus Christ and I have seen both where I believe for the miraculous and I received it and where I believe and don’t. I don’t follow the Word of Faith doctrine strictly but I see some places in scripture that do indicate that one should have dogged determination in prayer and not just give up easily .
Word of faith says “my will be done.” True Christianity says “thy will be done.” The two are complete opposites. Playing with some of word of faith is like playing with matches. You will get burned.
Why are you teaching against something? Why not just preach the truth. I believe the Word of Faith teaching to be an error but I would rather preach the truth that faith is not about the outcome it is trust in God regardless of the outcome. Hebrews 11 says these died in faith having not received the promise. Spend more time on truth not so much against because you end stating errors yourself.
Why preach against something? For years he preached error and hurt many by it. He’s now preaching truth. Why not ask Paul and Peter why they preached against those who also preached error? Because to say nothing or remain silent is to agree. Evil persists when good men remain silent.
BRAVA, thank you for your courage in exposing this cult. My heart hurts for all the folks these snakes and false teachers have willfully and wickedly destroyed. Woe comes to such without question……
Thanks again……………………………………..
I was in a Word faith church and the Lord led me out of it. As time went on, He (no one else) deprogrammed me. He showed me that the Word Faith Movement teach a different gospel in that they teach that Jesus Died Spiritually and suffered in hell. They also teach that yes we are gods (they are polytheists). You will not find them teaching that you are to die to self nor will you find them teaching ‘the sovereignty of God.’
With its wrong understanding on what faith is and the confessing of faith they become very legalistic not only in the way that they live but also in the way that they speak and think.
It’s sad that so many do fall for the trap of trying to take things into their own hands rather than leave them in God’s hands.
Reblogged this on An Author's Blog and commented:
My classmate attempted to use a video by Hagin against me as a few King James Only types too so you have to realize coming into this with a sense of logic. I am a horror author and I create instruments of horror on my own terms and writing a new story that I am writing I am taking these movements dead on because some of the Assemblies of God congregations had took Hagin’s teachings to heart. Word of Faith Movement if you’re listening to this — leave the scares to those who get paid to scare people
Word Faith theology is doing untold damage to a clear presentation of God’s love through Jesus Christ. Many competent scholars and ministers have already admonished key leaders of this destructive movement. John MacArthur, Hank Hanegraaf, Richard Abanes and others have confronted and effectively defeated the deceptive arguments and scripture twisting promoted by these “preachers” and “teachers.”
They have already called these people out by name, and it is not my intention to do that again here.
Instead, I would like to identify several destructive consequences of this modern heresy that hurt many people today:
1. Word faith sets up a group of “super apostles” over and against common followers of Jesus. By doing this, it violates the command against partiality found in James.
2. Material wealth becomes the ultimate mark of who is “blessed” and who is not. This assumption completely bypasses scriptures against corrupt riches.
3. There is no room for persecution in Word Faith theology, unless understood as the burden of being “blessed” materially.
4. A robust view of sin is replaced by a strong polemic against thinking incorrectly and “negative” confessions. These are the new targets for Word Faith teachers.
5. In a stealth sort of way, Word Faith advocates ridicule, blame, target and manipulate the poor. By making personal trials the sole responsibility of each individual believer, they spread the blanket of blame.
6. Finally, related to this point is an incipient libertarianism in Word Faith teachings. Since individuals are to “blame” in their system for lack of faith or positive confessions, the Christian community is absolved of responsibility for any bad things that happen to others. Thus, in the end, Word Faith embraces a “spiritualized” survival-of-the-fittest mentality, denying mercy, compassion and grace to the spiritually “inferior.”
Word Faith is not historic Christianity. In the end, it is toxic, religious bullying, at odds with the love of Jesus Christ.
For those who have time, please read the following sources, continue to pray and study God’s Word:
Hanegraaf, Hank. Christianity in Crisis: The 21st Century (Nashville, TN: Thomas Nelson, 2012).
Hanegfaaf, Hank. Counterfeit Revival (Nashville, TN: Thomas Nelson, 2001).
Horton, Michael Scott, ed. Power Religion: The Selling Out of the Evangelical Church? (Chicago: Moody Press, 1992).
Horton, Michael, ed. The Agony of Deceit: What Some TV Preachers are Really Saying (Chicago: Moody Press, 1990).
MacArthur, John F., Jr. Charismatic Chaos (Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 1993).
MacArthur, John. Strange Fire: The Danger of Offending the Holy Spirit with Counterfeit Worship (Nashville, TN: Nelson Books, 2013).
i belive it is not good to said something bad about other christians,but i also do not agree with faith teaching,i find this arctical,because wanted to know some opinion on this topic,sorry for my english,i find it myself immposible to live according to faith teaching,for example we should do things from faith,if i believed that i am now healed,i shouldnt take any medication,i shouldnt go to doctor even if i broke my leg,i shouldnt speak about illness,but if i can be ill according to bible i can speak about my problem,if i told someone now that i am healed i would be a liar.i believe simply in anoiting with oil and prayer,i belive also that we were healed beacause of Jesus,that it is a promise,that it maens that it is God will for people,i would be interested how do you believe about healing?why you warn people about faith teaching,i think God can show every one what is good or not,
You didn’t include number 17 in your list of 31. I want to repost this, but I need number 17. Thank you. This is excellent for apologetics in following Christ.
May God bless you and keep you safe, May his true words enlighten you and keep you growing in his real truths. I was also sucked in by a cult…the Mormons! But their teachings did not match what the bible said…I never made it to the temple, thank God, I saw their practices on you tube and I was shocked at how much of a Masonic cult they truley are. But in my decisions to leave God led me to scriptures that clarified boldly how wrong the Mormons were. Sounds like he did the same for you…how beutiful He is. May you continue to follow His true words. What I have come to understand is that there is no religion in heaven, only God’s word! So that’s what I practice now, just His words…I don’t need some cult to twist my mind and put false fears into me, for their benefit. May God bless you, keep you safe and show you through His words what His true everlasting love is…it’s simple, His purpose for us is simply to seek Him out and love Him. After everything he has done for us, with his creations and everything he has given us to sustain life….that’s all he asks in return! That’s true love my friend😊
We once had the beginnings of a wonderful church but then our pastor or yet to be pastor, hooked up with some word of faith boys in Tennessee and what started out as an innocent group of believers turned into a controlled atmosphere of an ugly cult. This ruined many peoples live and their walk with God. I thankfully always resisted and suffered for it till finally enough people had their eyes opened and one morning service we just walked out. I am still bearing the wounds in my heart from this experience.
So glad you knew it as wrong and resisted. And you suffered for it too. The parable of the sower applies here. Sometimes people endure for a while, then they quit.
John ,if you are a Christian, then you are my brother and in love I’ll tell you that you are the biggest woos that I ever heard! Waaah! How old are you? You never were a faith Preacher you were the fake preacher and never was called to the Five fold Ministry – so don’t go blaming everyone else for what you made of yourself – you probably still can’t hear the Voice of the Holy Spirit can you? – so you weren’t even believing what you said, never mind what God was saying to you – you are the one caught up in the flesh – just looking at what you talk about and allow others to religiously flesh out about with you!
If you did accept Christ Jesus in your life that makes you one of God’s sons – now grow up!
Find out what that means!
Do you think you can handle the Truth of God? Are you willing – it comes with a price!
You better turn back to God brother, and listen up – the days of Ananias and Sapphira will be back soon – The Holy Spirit in His Fullness won’t allow anymore playing Church or Playing religion – that is for the immature – they never grow up – because they don’t want to! – and they act and talk just like the world,, only religiously
What God is about to do – if you keep this up you will be one of the foolish virgins – do you really want to go into the tribulation time … think about it again!
And that goes for the rest of you reading this too!
E-mail me and I’ll tell you more about what God is saying! The Person of God The Holy Spirit doesn’t lie!
He wants you and needs you – but do you really want Him?
Grace and Truth in Love In Christ,
Ron, an Apostle, Prophet &Teacher,
by the will of God, to all the saints and faithful in Christ Jesus,
(not of men, neither by man, but by the Holy Spirit and Jesus Christ, and God the Father who raised him from the dead;) 11/11/91
Ron,
Is your response a joke? Are you just a troll? I’m seriously hoping so. Because if you were being real then your comment is without a doubt the most infantile, flesh-inspired, borderline demonic diatribe I’ve ever heard before, and that’s saying a lot!
Did you even read John’s testimony or see his video? If so, you certainly comprehended nothing that he said. After all, darkness cannot comprehend light. If you are being real, then please get psychiatric help. Also, get thee behind us Satan. You are no prophet of God. You are an agent of the devil. Don’t blaspheme the Holy Spirit by blaming Him for your nonsense.
Ron, an Apostle, Prophet &Teacher,
I was wondering, as a teacher cum apostle, are you trying to teach people how to attack others. The reason I am asking is because what you posted to John seems an awful lot like an attack. I could be wrong, if so, I apologise, but….
What was Joh talking about to get you so worked up anyway? I also ask this because the was this blog goes it’s very ahrd to follow it let alone find what comment was what and who said what.
I am from Nepal and I’ve heard many teachings and read many books from Word of faith preachers. And I found out that everything is in line with the Word of God. Their teachings are sound and right. It’s actually changed my life. Miracles are happening. I just want to say that nothing is wrong in there. Its absolutely fine.
Ebenezerministry: so you believe that you are a god. as Ken Copeland teaches? You also believe that Satan had power over Jesus Christ? – As they all teach.
I have been teaching the Word of Faith for nearly 20 years and the list provided is completely inaccurate. Sad.
Thank you for honestly Shari G from an open heart. It is a fearful thing to confess one’s errors in such a public forum. One again, thank you and God bless you and your family.
Tithing was under and is under the law with a curse for Christians seeking salvation under the law, Galatians 3:3-13, Malachi 3:1-18. When pastors and priests lie by quoting Malachi 3:1-18,under the law IN OLD COVENANT, how many Christians line up to be served with food when tithes and offering under the law are given? Is the storehouse pastors’ and priests’ house or the Church being the body of Christ? Saved Christians by grace IN NEW COVENANT who are lead and taught by the Holy Spirit are not under law or in generation curse in the law. Tithes in Malachi 3:1-18 were primarily for the tribe of Levi which was not allocated land for sharing among themselves , Numbers 18:20-28 . Those who simply imply Christians are under curse for not tithing put into question about unfinished work of redemption (SALVATION) by Christ Jesus on cross of Calvary which is bought and maintained continuously in tithes paid to them. Yet Christ is not ashamed to call us brethren whom He has sanctified. Hebrew 2:9-13.We have been redeemed from the curse of the law, Jesus Christ being made a curse for us : for it is written, cursed is everyone that hangs on a tree. Galatians 3:8-13. Christians saved by grace are ministers of the new testament born of love with exceeding glory which surpassed the glory that was in law with Moses. We have been redeemed from the curse of the law to adoptions of sons in Royal Priesthood. Pastors ,Priest and Bishops who are servants of God cannot subject sons of God in Royal Priesthood to tithe taxes which absolutely illegal for we are not under the curse of the law, Galatians 5:1, Galatians4:4-5,2 Corinthians 3:1-18. Sins sacrifices ,offerings under the law, curses, and generation curses under law in the old covenant remained up to death of Jesus Christ on Calvary when He fulfilled the requirements of the law. Salvation under the law one attains it at last breath on earth having done all that pertains to the law which is hard for one to accomplish. Even the tithe which was given by Abraham was under the law of sin and death from the fallen state of Adam and Eve at the garden of Aden. Those who lie would like to deceive Christians that tithe was before the law but before which law. When Christ our High Priest was born He was given gifts and not tithes Mathew 2:11-12. Salvation under spiritual law of love by grace is freely given and attained with free miracles from God our Father, Ephesians 2:4 -9, Ephesians 2:13 -20. Under Leviticus priesthood which belonged to the tribe of Levi, tithes were given to Levites priests for use by the whole tribe of Levi and tithe of tithe to the high Priest for they shared no land apart from the walled towns they were allocated to stay in for their continuous sacrifice to God, Numbers 18:20 -29. Widows, strangers ,fatherless and orphans benefited from tithes and offerings given to Levites, Deuteronomy 14:22-29. In Christianity widows were asked to be catered by close brethren to ease burden to the Church. There were also tithes of different kinds in Israel. There was also a tithe where a family had to eat all before the Lord, Deutreronomy12:6-7. In Christ Jesus we are saved by grace to adoptions of sons in Royal Priesthood of Christ (for Christians)and not by works of law ,Galatians 3:8-13,Acts13: 38-39, Galatians 4: 4-5, Galatians2:16-21, Galatians 5:18. Sons have direct access to the Father and free common inheritance not bought or worked for from the Father. For servants ( Pastors and Priests) are servants of God worthy all respects and due help. Much preaching is done in grace and love to Christians at early stages who are later sleeking entangled and enslaved in fear under the bondage of law in tithes emphatically taught by many in seeking dwindling fortune entrenched in tithes falsehood. The Church of Christ is founded in love by grace and a worker is worthy his labor. The Apostles and disciples of Jesus Christ understood from onset of Christ’s Ministry that they were not under Leviticus Priesthood and had no share in Leviticus Priesthood allotments. Thus questions were raised of their take and benefits in the Royal Priesthood of Jesus Christ Ministry in the New Covenant, Mathew 19:23-30 . Leviticus Priesthood allotments existed before well-known and were already defined in obliged tithing. Christian were never left under leadership of Leviticus Priesthood. Christians are humbly called upon to support tithes sweetened falsehood purposed to enhance good glorious intentions communicated a smart way which form practically some mega success which should not divert Christians from free spiritual giving. The essence of Christians righteousness in salvation by grace is more falsely tied to tithes by the clergy and the bar raised often higher as they become masters of confusion in tithes falsehood teaching. Even Judas Iscariot is not recorded asking for tithes. We firmly stand by the truth our mouths being boldly louder and we faint not as we manifest the truth to man’s conscience to God without honoring personality clout in uncovering tithes falsehood taught, 2Corinthians 4:1-2. They keep asking what is wrong with us to be at pains on tithes falsehood? There is nothing wrong with us and we have wronged no one except those who stumble on the truth who want to appease in falsehood.
IN NEW TESTAMENT two priesthood are compared and the need to replace the old covenant expounded. Hebrew7: 7-28, Hebrew8:6 -13, Hebrew 9:6-9, Hebrew 10:8-23. Leviticus priesthood under the law with tithes, death, discontinuity and its acceptance under glory of law without the great commission was done away in Christ and the Holy Priesthood of Christ without tithes, death and discontinuity with exceeding glory under which Christians are in salvation being a Holy nation and Loyal Priests to preach to the world GOD being their Father in New Covenant Ministry. In that He said, a new covenant He has made the first old. Now that which decays and waxed old is ready to vanish away Hebrew8:-13. God related with Adam and Eve in the garden of Aden under command of not eating from tree of knowledge and evil , Abraham related to God in faith when he was called out of Ur. The Israel related to God under law given to Moses under old the Covenant and we saved Christians relate to God under Spiritual law of love by grace in Jesus Christ in New Covenant where we get our salvation. Tithing weakens the Royal Priesthood of Christians in Christ where Christians are supposed to give themselves as living sacrifice in the mission vision fields. The Christians Royal Priesthood in Christ Jesus is internally weekend from within ,fought and economically drained mostly for indoors ministries under revival of Leviticus priesthood by pastors. The Royal Priesthood is internally spiritually emaciated and trodden upon.2 Corinthians2:1-13, 2Peter 2:5-9. Priesthood involves sacrifices and Jesus Christ did not choose Priesthood among the five fold ministry since saved Christians are in the Royal Priesthood and we have been asked to give ourselves as living sacrifice. The priesthood was changed from the old covenant( Leviticus Priesthood) to the new covenant (Loyal Priesthood of labor in Christ without tithes allocations which is not appreciated) and the law governing it was changed. Christ requested His disciples to give the crowd food to eat , Matthew 14:15-16. Jesus Christ told Peter look after his lambs and later to look after His sheep ( service) in clear shift from Leviticus priesthood which does not apply to Christians, John 21:15-17. JESUS CHRIST our High Priest is the mediator of the better New Covenant established upon better promises. Hebrew8:6-8. Under Leviticus priesthood an animal for sacrifice was alive between the alter of sacrifice and the Levite priest holding the sacrificial knife. Sheep remained alive for a period of time only when they were delivered many animals for sacrifice and the altar could not hold them all for sacrifice .We are dead to sin and alive in Christ who live in us being a living sacrifice to God. Christians saved by grace in love of Christ Jesus in Royal Priesthood within the New Covenant cannot be dragged back to curses enslavement in the law in Leviticus Priesthood in Old Covenant. The Royal Priesthood of labor of service in Christ Jesus is loathed by many clergy who opt for Leviticus Priesthood of waiting at the sanctuary for provision given for altar sacrifices. It is only through concealed falsehood that the clergy merge the Leviticus Priesthood under law in old Covenant ( which remained hostile to Christians), with the Royal Priesthood by grace in Christ love liberated in New Covenant. The Royal Priesthood of Jesus Christ bears no self-restrictions or inhibitions in fear of men in preaching and teaching the Gospel of Jesus Christ since it has no people driven demand support pegged on expectations anchored under the law. Christians should give liberally in love as God has blessed us ,2 Corinthians9 :6-7, Galatians 5:1. Galatians6:6-10. Tithes crusader teach well packaged tithes falsehood from the pulpit managed humbly in sheep skins. Christians are increasingly facing common mounted front in tithes falsehood which is demanded by elites clergies as a Christian doctrine in Churches. It is easy for many unsuspecting Christian to take it as the Gospel truth. The remnant few faithful Christians must firmly teach Christian doctrine on giving bearing in mind they stand on highways of interests of elites clergies on tithes falsehood taught with awkward elites church elders support . The humble craving of comfortable falsehood artistically and passionately taught on tithes by the clergy should not make Christians lose focus in Christian giving in love. Bishops, pastors, priests, church elders and those read the OLD TESTAMENT (Covenant ) BLINDED BY THE VEIL that is in law that was done away in Jesus Christ keep Christians in fear under bondage of law which is abolished and miss the righteousness in liberty sanctified in Jesus Christ. 2Corithians3: 6-18 . Successful prosperity based on falsehood cannot be accepted as blessing in holiness. Truth is easily dismissed but never nullified on tithes falsehood taught by the clergy. Christians must remain Pentecostal and evangelical in the Royal Priesthood of Jesus Christ without entangling themselves in Leviticus Priesthood bound in bondage of the law. Christ came to not to destroy the law and the prophets but to fulfill so as the enmity that was against us in the law was abolished on the cross. A way by Grace in Jesus Christ’s love for mankind was established for our salvation after Christ fulfilled the prophecy and the law. Before HIS DEATH THE LAW WAS UPHELD TO THE LETTER .Mathew5:17-19, Ephesians 2:4—20. He paved the narrow highway of righteousness in salvation by grace, Isaiah35:1-10. Tithes falsehood nullifies grace and love bestowed on them by Jesus Christ. Those who want to seek salvation under law with curses of law should continue in glory of the law and fulfill the whole law without entangling salvation by grace in Christ’s love with law in any lewd manner since the glory in law in old testament at fault (where God found faults with them) was to be done away and was abolished, 2Corinthians 3:1-18 Galatians2:16-21, Galatians3:1-13 ,Galatians4:4-5, Hebrew8:6-13. The Church of Jesus Christ is established by grace in Christ’s love in the glory of the new testament that excels.
Levites Pastors and Priests are comfortable and friendly to brethren who live like dead sacrifice with almost free access to tithes. Levites priests were to labor to sacrifice and not tendering the flocks or do any farming ,Numbers 18:20-32 Joshua7:7.They lived in walled towns .Pastors and Priests who revive the Leviticus priesthood removed by Christ for Christians and meticulously merge it to the Loyal Priesthood of Christ do so for personal gains in mass concealed cheating in tithes allocations. The old covenant had amassed personal sought atonement for sins through animals sacrifices but the new covenant has atonement for sins in Christ’s blood. Leviticus priesthood under law remained hostile to the Ministry of Jesus Christ and His disciples who suffered in their hands even after Christ’s death, Mathew 27:12-17. Levite priests beat and wanted to kill all disciples of Christ whom they told not to preach in His name. Acts 5:17-42. Today levites clergy tell Christian that their salvation by grace is not complete without paying them tithes which is a lie. Let well educated brethren teach the Word of God the same way as learned Doctor Luke and Br. Paul did for spiritual growth of the body of Christ. Let well educated Christians stand for justice like Dr. Gamaliel who was a doctor of law who in his response rescued the apostles from eminent death in the hands of Levite priests Acts;5:17-42. What pastors are not telling the Church (the bride/sons/ ambassadors /advocate, royal priests, and ministers of the new covenant in the Word/children and servants made friends by His Holy calling) is the reason Jesus Christ had in choosing the twelve disciples ( under new covenant in Grace ) and opted not to use the Levite Priests (in old covenant under law) that were well established and placed had they to be chosen preach to the world. LET PASTORS , BISHOPS AND PRIESTS HONESTLY PURGE THEIR HEARTS AND SPEAK THE TRUTH ON TITHES. CHRIST IS THE END OF THE LAW IN THE OLD COVENANT. The intrigue of doctrinal falsehood on tithes smartly engineered and flamboyantly taught by them worldwide cannot be justified or be cleansed by their religious social status. Christians should not be for entertainments but for truth in Holiness preached and taught which is not in contest in numerical strength for acceptance. It quite clear from the Bible that there is no perfection and justification under works of the law. Galatians 2:16- 21, Galatians 3:8-13,Galatians 4;4-5,Galatians 5:1,18. FOR CHRISTIANS GOD HAS NO PLEASURE FOR SACRIFICES AND OFFERINGS AND BURNT OFFERINGS AND OFFERINGS FOR SINS AND FOR WHICH IS OFFERED UNDER THE LAW. HEBREW 10: 8-9 . THIS SCRIPTURE THEY WOULD WISH IT NEVER EXISTED. Can those who advocate for tithes honestly deny openly that there were sacrifices and offerings under law not acceptable to God for Christians? Tithes advocates call Christians passionately to tithe an illustration of spiritual disconnect to bridge. WHY WOULD THE CLERGY NOT TELL CHRISTIANS TO SACRIFICE FOR THEIR SINS BUT TITHE? Selective preaching and teaching on tithes falsehood cover up still remains. Tithes falsehood taught has remained guarded and guided in shrewd cover up of honored fortune justification hidden in tithes falsehood teaching proliferation. Christians must know the truth to be free and move from being trapped in great justified doctrinal falsehood taught ,Ephesians4:11-14. In law men in old covenant remained the instructors and enforcers of the law. In new covenant the Holy Spirit remains our wonderful teacher and counselor in grace. For sure those who are in bondage of the law have men appreciation at hand but those lead by the Holy Spirit in Liberty within the yoke of Christ in grace have the acceptance of God. Christians should not be held spiritually hostage by unifying falsehoods taught in concealed falsehood out of labor. This would be spiritual blindness and slavery for many Christians hard for some to overcome. Apostles did not teach and preach the Gospel Of Jesus Christ through deceptive greediness but by sound doctrines, 2Peter:1-3. Christians taught for doctrines the commandments of men replace Jesus Christ for men who become their gods (idol worship based on men). They admire them for their earthly great achievements and they testify much of their stardom. Mathew 15: 5-9. There is the church of men where men teach for doctrines commandments of men and Church of Jesus Christ which cannot be swallowed by institutionalized organized falsehood and greed concealed in martyrdom of false knowledge which is not in the True Word of God. Even those workers of iniquity with miracles shall not cheat and defeat the church of Christ since He holds the Church in His holy hands in due time. Matthew15:8-9. The gates of hell shall not prevail over the Church of Jesus Christ. Mathew16:18. The Church of Christ cannot live by glorious commandments instituted by men standards. Christians must break free and be clean from men commandments enslavement. Christians’ true love and care will then freely flourish. Christians should not feel comfortable for being appreciated for accepting and supporting goals of concealed falsehood taught through feigned words in covetousness to make merchandise of us,2 Peter2:1-3. Falsehood clarified and justified in concealed covetousness is hard for many Christians to overcome. Many Christians plunged globally into tithe doctrinal falsehood and held spiritually captive by clergy that are Levites require spiritual rescue and deliverance. The Church must wrestle herself free from shrewd elite spiritual con-men who keep the Church of Jesus Christ under bondage of the law. Tithe given by Abraham in faith in God and tithes given by Israel under the law given to Moses are not in the Royal Priesthood in new Covenant of Jesus Christ put under carpet by tithes crusaders. Tithe given by Abraham to Melchisedec had no third party human usage tied to it. Tithes given under the laws had personal usage, third party human usage and were used by the Levites Priests and the Levites tribe. Windows ,orphans and strangers benefited from the tithes offerings and offerings received by the Levite priests. To quote the tithe given out of war by Abraham the father of faith to justify tithes given by the Royal priests (Saved Christians by Grace ) is more mischievously misleading even when tied to helping the spread of the Gospel Jesus Christ a self- righteousness imposed requirement under men law for doctrine. Jesus Christ did not allocate tithes to spreading of the Gospel in the hands of Levites Priests and Pastors who are taking Christians Spiritually for a ride. Success built on falsehood should not dampen Christians quest for truth and justice in holiness without deceit. For many to hear the truth that tithe is not a Christian doctrine in the ROYAL PRIESTHOOD OF JESUS CHRIST, it is like venom to them. The only option left for them is to rush to the final line of defense and hid under falsehood by using well endorsed and educated elite Christians to teach humbly tithes falsehood escalation with well loaded professional cover up backing. Let the clergy deny openly falsehood on tithes taught and not use third parties blinded by the vaill in reading the old testament that was removed by Jesus Christ for a cover up 2Corinthians 3:1-18. Truth is easily dismissed but never nullified. Christians should not embrace scheduled resourceful falsehood taught in honor. Christian Churches must remain Sanctuaries of true love in grace instituted by our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. God calls us to the holy mountain of reasoning in liberty of faith in Christ Jesus, Isaiah 1:18-20, Galatians5:1, 18. The implication of self-imprisonment by Christians in men’s law for doctrines is spiritually devastating. The glory achieved is the glory of men.
They are amazed and bitter for we stand for Christ without seeking their favor or consultation on tithes issues without joining the sweeping wave in teaching tithes falsehood benefits acclaimed. The way some have reacted vilely to those who are opposed to tithes as a doctrinal falsehoods for Christians shows well from the comfort of their hearts that they are deeply dismayed and battered by the truth and have realized they are known on cheating on tithes fortunes acclaimed. It befit us well to be called Christians of low estate with little minds rattling for we have not been soothed smoothly cool to support tithes falsehood taught in order for us to fit perfectly in the will of Jesus Christ with no regrets. We are satisfied with what God has provided us without gains of falsehood. We do not clamor for glamorous wealth of falsehood. They have stood as heroes in championing tithing as a way getting blessings for Christians from God which we have totally disagreed with them which they took as affront to their spiritual dignity. They have degraded the Royal Priesthood of Christ and nullified grace and love of Christ to themselves. We are aware there are spiritual babies on milk and feeble who are tossed to and fro by every kind doctrines who have not come to the full knowledge of truth. It will be unjust to us if do not take spiritual care of them and love them in Christ’s love, Hebrew5: 13-14. Those asking for revelation on tithes are asking for undeserved free room of manipulation to lie. Their theoretical assumption on tithes as the only easy way of meeting Church needs requirements through tithes justified falsehood taught to Christians saved by grace deserve spiritual analyses. Blessing and curses dealt with in tithes in old covenant are clear to those who seek truth in clear knowledge of wisdom. The same is theoretically assumed and taught on Abel offering being accepted because he offered animal sacrifice and burnt fats as sweat savor to God. Cain offering was not accepted just because were seeds and fruits. Abel chose the best and considered the even age of his sacrifice offered to God. No special sacrificial preparation on Cain offering was dedicated to God. Cain did not pay deserved attention on what he offered to sacrifice to God. God told him if he did well his offering would be accepted. God did not tell Cain to replace his offering with animal sacrifice. He was to do well to his offering for his acceptance and offering. Genesis 4:1–7. Cain offering had no respect for God and God had no regards for it. CEREALS AND FRUITS WERE NOT REMOVED FROM BEING OFFERED IN THE OLD COVENANT.
THEY LIE IN WAIT TO DECEIVE MANY UNSUSPECTING BELIEVERS NOT KNOWING WHAT THEIR ARE TAUGHT MANY TIMES HAD BEEN DISCUSSED IN COUNCILS OF MEN FOR UNIFORMITY AND NOT WITH THE HOLLY SPIRIT. IF TITHES WERE TO BE APPLICABLE AND JUSTIFIABLE IN THE NEW COVENANT ,ALL TITHES SHOULD BE SHARED EQUALLY AMONG ALL BRETHREN SINCE WE ARE THE ROYAL PRIESTS MINISTERING THE NEW COVENANT. The tithe burden is not for Christians . Let Bishops ,Pastors, Priests and Church Elders handle the Church of Christ within Christians doctrines established by Our Lord Jesus Christ and His Apostles in the mission field vision. CHRISTIANS MUST FACE AND ADDRESS THE MASS SWEEPING AND SOOTHING FALSEHOOD TAUGHT BY SOME WELL EDUCATED ELITE CHRISTIANS ABOUT TITHES BENEFITS AND BLESSINGS IN A SOBER SPIRITUAL REALITY FACE OUT. Tithes teaching is unexpected real falsehood investment from those held dearly in trust by many Christians who regard them us spiritual leaders. The situation becomes more murky and tricky when church elders are accomplished in the classic falsehood which puts the church into mental slavery. Irrelevant testimonies are given of blessed Christians even who gave beyond 70% and remained richly blessed to encourage giving beyond 10% for more blessings. Having given 70% and being left with 30% translates to millions of dollars left for their personal use. The same 70% if applied by Christians of minimal income will leave them in the cold without basics needs requirements being meet. They have encouraged Christians even to give beyond the law requirement to appear more spiritual. This is bound to impoverish Christians who will appear to have enmity with God in their old age. When the Government taxation is at 30% and the pastors at 10% without being end of requirement to give, almost 50% income is gone from the Christians who are offered weekly prayers for prosperity and blessings. How committed will these Christians be us Royal Priests to the great commission at grass root levels? Tithing is more emphasized to salaries without shame. Some have tragically wished Christians not to be employed who do not tithe to them. It would be sheer folly for Christians to become submissive hopeful prisoners under falsehood taught by those blinded by veil in bondage under law in the old covenant, Galatians 31-13, Galatians 5:1. Christians cannot buy salvation from the hands of the clergy under yard stick of salvation justification in tithes set by the clergy.
It is quite easy to justify tithes falsehood based on easily acquired wealth which meet the church needs which operates under Leviticus Priesthood. The Royal Priesthood in grace is quite different from Leviticus Priesthood under the law. Leviticus Priesthood in the old covenant belonged to the Levite tribe among the eleven tribes in Israel but the Royal Priesthood in the new covenant under oppression and suppression belongs to all brethren in the world in Christ Jesus ( the Church / the body of Christ) who are ministers of the new covenant commissioned to preach to the world. The Royal Priesthood is well placed to reach the world more effectively at close quarters in Christ love and glory expected. It is quite unfortunate that Christians unknowingly are victims of systematic unmarked high professional intellectual falsehood commercialization cover up in tithes teaching by learned elites Christians brethren which is a disservice to the (church) body of Christ. But Christians have been warned not to be fools since for some preaching and teaching falsehood is a smart act energetically engaged and Christians are openly conned .Ephesians 5:15-16. Tithing under law impoverishes the Royal Priesthood of Christ physically and spiritually which make the Great commission less effective. When all saved Christians are in Royal Priesthood, to whom do you tithe to in the in new covenant? The Royal Priesthood needs to take its place in Christian missions empowered in New Covenant for Christians to work in glory of Christ love intended for the body of Christ. It quite clear from the Bible that there is no perfection and justification under works of the law. Galatians 2:16- 21, Galatians 3:8-13,Galatians 4;4-5, Galatians 5:1,18. Hebrew 10;8-9. Jesus Christ and his twelve disciples did not ask for tithes but only comments were made on tithes under the law. As early church had needs equally relevant to their time and did not ask for tithes, we too have needs relevant to our time which require sacrificial offerings to solve problems but no through tithes offerings under the law with a curse. Saved Christians ( The Body of Christ /Church/ Royal Priests) are able ministers of the new testament which is not sorely the burden of the clergy as some would like us to believe in their theoretical tithes justification support for the clergy and meeting Church needs requirements.
A fountain cannot produce sweet and bitter water the same time. James 3:8-18. A new piece of cloth does not patch an old cloth nor do men put new wine in old bottles. Matthew 9:16-17. And with the priesthood changed there was need of changing the law governing it. Our royal priesthood in Christ Jesus is not after law of carnal commandment but after power of endless life Hebrews 7:7-26 .We Christian are saved by GRACE IN CHRIST LOVE(Spiritual Law) for we cannot be subjected to carnal law of sin and death crucified and done away by Christ on cross of Calvary. We are subjected to spiritual law of life in New Covenant in Christ Jesus and ought to have the spiritual understanding of the Word of God in liberty without corrupting the Word of God. Roman 8:1-2, Colossi ans 1:9-10. As God has blessed us in common inheritance of the saints, we should give sacrificially as we have purposed in our hearts in liberty and in love, Galatians 5:1, 2Corinthians 9;6-7, Galatians 6:6-7, Hebrew6:6-12,Hebrew13:11-16. Christ taught spiritual giving to God and to our parents, Luke 6:8 ,Matthew15:5-9. Paul also taught the same .2Corinthians 9:6-14, Philippians 2:4-5. Aaron was given unto Moses, the Levite priests were given unto Aaron, the eleven tribes of Israel were given unto Levite tribe to serve them but we Christians are purchased through the blood of Christ we are no man servants but servants of Christ 1Corinthians 7:21-2 ,God is our Father and our readily help in times of needs and not men. We are warned not to call any man our father in the spirit. Mathew23:9. Some have made men their fathers and call them fathers turning them their gods on earth. Numbers 3:9-15. No servant can hinder children access to the Father and His blessed inheritance. Are pastors, priest and Bishops in the Royal Priesthood of Christ or are in the Leviticus priesthood? Who coordinate pastors only to work for Christ for a living. Apostles of Christ worked with their own hands for a living and for preaching the Gospel of Christ. All saved Christians are servants of Christ in the Royal Priesthood of Christ. Do we make the spiritual understanding between the Leviticus Priesthood under the law and the Royal Priesthood in grace in the New Covenant or do we mix the two distinctive priesthoods cunningly for selfish gain to eliminate the so called clergy poverty and mess up with the doctrine of salvation in Grace? Christ gave some apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, some pastors and some teachers for the perfecting of saint in the work of the ministry for edifying the( church) body of Christ so us not to be deceived Ephesians4:11-19. Who set aside and allocated poverty and tithes to the pastors in preaching the Gospel of Christ since those who preach the Gospel (Christians/Royal priests) shall live by the Gospel or who bear the burden of mercy for the clergy to teach and preach falsehood on tithes for them not to be poor? When did they become pastors in poverty for the church to eliminate their poverty? Christians should share their wealth with the clergy willingly in Christ love but not in law. We are saved by Grace in Christ’s love and our sharing should be in love. We saved Christians are not justified by the law. Galatians 2:21. We saved Christians are servants of Christ Jesus in the Royal Priesthood of the Saints. Why do many talk about key poverty of pastors on tithes among the five fold ministry? Where is their care and concerns for the other four ministries for they vouched for tithes not for the benefit of the body of Christ? This has brought a flood gate of preaching entrepreneurship boom diligently anchored by many on salvation under yardstick of tithes obligation. Some have spoken from the pulpit of brethren who don’t allow them eat tithes from their labor. Do they preach and teach for souls to be saved or for economic gains in tithes eating? Are they in LEVITICUS PRIESTHOOD or in THE ROYAL PRIESTHOOD OF JESUS CHRIST? A GENUINE ANSWER IS REQUIRED FOR NON DOUBLE STANDARD DOCTRINAL FAITH. For Christians it should be precepts upon precepts without contradictions.
Should the pastors ministry overshadow other ministries? All ministries should work as one body in the body of Christ. Foot soldiers who support falsehood on tithes preaching and teaching are calling Christians who do not support tithing to ask for forgiveness in face saving cover up. They have stood as heroes of faith in tithes teachings falsehood. Christians bear no apology to no one for preaching and teaching the truth . Only those who preach and teach falsehoods are hurt by the truth. Christians should not be coaxed by great promises and deadly threats hedged in none doctrinal falsehoods promises taught in guarded personal ego gains. With God, the means justify the end in Jesus Christ. Christians should not be hoodwinked by GROANING DELIVERY OF FALSEHOOD AND THE GLORY associated with the fruits of falsehood benefits . As we speak on the falsehood on the doctrine of tithing for Christians, we have not closed our eyes to the needs of the Church nor have buried our heads in the sand devoid of understanding of our emotions to face the truth. We stand for truth aware of forces against the truth within the Church and outside the Church. We have been asked to ask for forgiveness for not supporting tithing without being told from whom to apply for forgiveness. We do not pursue and preserve justified falsehoods which meet easily the needs of the Church for with God, the means justify the end in Christ. We are told we point an accusing finger to the clergy on issues concerning tithes falsehoods. We are part of the body of Christ and no part of the body accuses other parts. All body parts coordinate in functions and take care of one another when giving our body parts that are not comely more honor .We only pin point doctrinal falsehood taught by clergy thus taking care of the body of Christ spiritually in love. We do not waver in our minds and hearts in our stand on tithes issues. If one is stuck in sticky clay of falsehood, us a Christian one has to owner up and warm up to the truth and shape up to be free in did. We are fully aware of glorious unstable spiritual empires built on quick sand by men through falsehood under threat from the truth. If the empires fall apart there is no loss for Christians to worry about for apology. We are warned of danger of teaching and preaching the truth by exposing ourselves to well organized affluent churches of humble men. We stand for Christ in life and death without shame . Well organized fruitful falsehoods from those in authority do not translate to truth and righteousness, 2 Corinthians11:13-14.
Those under the law are under curse and the law kills 2 Corinthians 3:6. Those lead by the Spirit are not under law and curses Galatians5: 6, Galatians 3:8-13. Christians are redeemed from the curse of the law to adoption of sons . Roman 8:1-17,Galatians4:4- 5. We saved Christians are not under law but under grace Roman6:13-14.Are they telling Christians curses under law are blessings for them or they have powers to remove curses when Christians tithe to them? Christians must remain spiritually alert and be not be spiritually blind, They have directed Christians to deceptive ways of curses for their own benefits and not blessings. The bounty of terror of deceptive covetousness is professionally tactically presented as blessing based on salvation under yard stick of tithes. Many pastors have illegally allocated all tithes to themselves. Tithes were for specifics needs under old covenant for specific people help. Apostles of CHRIST did not use concealed deceptive covetousness to preach the Gospel .1Thessalonians2:3-6.We should renounce hidden things of dishonesty and not walk craftily handling the Word of God deceitfully 2Corithians 4:1-2. In tithes teaching the clergy makes spot of the needs for the better faultless New Covenant in obtained excellent ministry established upon better promises which has specific intended goals in Love by Grace in Jesus Christ. Hebrew 8:6-8. Christians are Spiritually born in the new Covenant by Grace in Love in Christ Jesus.
The body of CHRIST has been subjected to doctrinal mess by Levite priests and Levite pastors. TITHE IS A PURE CLASSIC SLEEK DOCTRINAL FALSEHOOD FOR CHRISTIANS CULTIVATED IN UNMATCHED PERSONAL CONCEALED ZEAL BY PASTORS IN LEADERSHIP FOR PERSONAL INTERESTS AND GAINS WHO UNDERSTAND UNIVERSALLY ON TITHES AND SALVATION AND FAIL TO APPRECIATE THE TIME OF LAW AND THE TIME OF GRACE DISPENSATION. In willful deception by calling themselves the Levites of today who persecuted Christians and plunder Christians pockets today they are able to demand to be given tithes. Levites priests and elders never gave a helping hand to Christians. Christ did not leave His Church under Leviticus Priesthood and no Levite priest was chosen as His Apostle . Leviticus Priesthood is forced on the throats of Christians by pastors for perfectly concealed selfish interests and gains. Do they want to tell us that Christ and Apostles of Christ forgot to ask for tithes during the early formative stage of Christian Ministry. When we take the Word of God out of its content and contest ,we have contempt for the Word of God. He (GOD)who brought tithing under the Old Covenant took it away in His(CHRIST) own Divine rights( after the order of Melchisedec) in the new Covenant. Perfection is in grace and not in law. Hebrew7: 7-26, Hebrew8:6-13 Hebrew9:1-27 Hebrew10:1-23. Leviticus Priesthood is impressive to many since it involves waiting at the sanctuary for provision and serving only at the altar of sacrifice. The order of Melchisedec was in Melchisedec Himself and existed before any tithe was offered. It is erroneously taught that tithes taught in the Old Covenant and comments made on tithes in the New Covenant in reference to Old Covenant sum up to uphold to tithe for Christians in order of Melchisedec which some teachings made suggest the order of Melchisedec in modeled on tithes. Now where is indicated in the Holly Bible that Abraham redeemed his first born sons Ishmael and Isaac when they were born since he operated in faith in God and not under the law. The law is not of faith. We are saved by grace from all sins of iniquities.
We can preach the Word of God quoting scriptures like the devil when he tested Jesus or quote the scriptures like CHRIST when He answered satan in time of need. Matthew 4:1-11 . Jesus Christ taught men can teach commandments of men for doctrines. Mathew15:5-9. This addressed falsehood which can come from those in authority in the Church ( bishops, pastors, priest and elders) leadership. We can have a zeal of faith and commitment to establish our own righteousness not according to righteousness of God in the knowledge of his Word. Roman 10:1-4. Pastors and priests calling themselves Levites today have capitalized on low level Christian doctrinal knowledge teachings among Christians. Tithing contradict the doctrine of salvation by GRACE and deprive the Christians in Loyal Priesthood in Christ Jesus the individual empowerment to do the Great Commission. When we are loyal Priests to whom do we tithe to? Is it not even if it were in Natural world for servants to tithe to Loyal Priests? Pastors Priest and Bishops are also in the Loyal Priesthood of Jesus Christ all of us being sons and servants composing the body of Christ unless they exclude themselves. The underlying mystery is to deliver the Church of Christ in concealed form to Leviticus Priesthood for Priests ,Pastor and Bishops to enable them demand tithes. Mathew15:5-9. We can preach the Word of God making the Church a house of merchandise to make merchandise of Christians and those who do so whose God is their belly which made Adam and Eve to fail in their relationship with God .It is a lucrative profitable business based on arithmetic of numbers cunningly preserved with tactical appreciations to the body of Christ and spreading of the Gospel. Are elect Christians deceived out of their wits? Romans 16:17 -19 ,2 Peter 2:1-3, John 2:16, Philppians3:17-19. We can preach Christ out of envy, strife or of good will. Philippians 1:15-17,2Corinthians4:1-2. It is the body of Christ the Church which is sent to preach to the world also as individuals brethren bearing the burden to preach to the world as Apostles of Christ did. The responsibility has not been on shoulders of priests and pastors only. Brethren are the loyal priests and ambassadors of Christ and has committed unto us the Church the word of reconciliation, 2 Corinthians :19-20. THERE WERE NO FENCE SITTINGS AND ARE NO FENCE SITTINGS IN THE NEW COVENANT MINISTRY MEDIATED BY OUR APOSTLE AND THE HIGH PRIEST OF OUR FAITH LORD JESUS CHRIST. Apostles labored with their hand to provide for preaching the Gospel of Jesus Christ and Christians’ offerings they received were not tithes. No one is specially chosen to be at receiving end of tithes so as to preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We saved Christians are the Loyal Priests AND Ambassadors of Jesus Christ.2 Peter 2:1-9, 2 Corinthians5:14-20. The preaching of the Gospel of Jesus Christ is not entirely sorely in the hands of clergy. It is in the hands of the (Church) believers composing the body of Jesus Christ.
Tithing is a hard topic to teach without spiritual understanding since we have many high profile elite preachers teaching on the same with books written of great hoped promises and condemnation on the same for those who do not tithe, Ephesians 5:6-7, 1Thessalonians 2:3-4. Some well educated elite Christians are involved in deceptive teaching on tithes which is warmly appreciated from the pulpit. They are the magnetizing force with alluring great hoped blessed promises of wealth based on tithes. When will it dawn on them that they teach doctrine of men on tithing for Christians saved by grace. On moving from one church to the church or by taking a flight from one continent to another continent on falsehood mission, lies taught on tithes by them cannot be justified by the sacrificial cost incurred to do so. Only when they uphold the truth and uplift Christ as they decrease and Christians stop earthly social status cult adoration in respect of human beings will truth prevails’. Pharisees and the Scribes were most well educated and Jesus said woe unto them seven times for being stumbling blocks in faith. Mathew 23:9-39. We only need to rightly divide the Word of God and know whether we are Christians seeking salvation under the law or we are Christians saved by grace in Christ through the Spiritual law of love, Corinthians 1:12-16,2 Timothy 2:15 . We redeemed sons of God who are made Kings and priests unto God have a common inheritance in Christ Jesus, Galatians 4:4-5, Colssians1:9-14 ,1Corinthians 2:12-16. Revelation 1;4-6 .Let well educated brethren teach the Word of God the same way as learned Doctor Luke and Br. Paul did for spiritual growth of the body of Christ. Let well educated Christians stand for justice like Dr . Gamaliel who was a doctor of law who in his response rescued the apostles from eminent death in the hands of Levite priests, Acts;5:17-42. We are called spiritual sons of God after salvation not before in fallen state and who are enabled to do the righteousness that was in the law but we are not under the law. The same priests and pastors wreck the spiritual scriptures when they teach fallen Angles are called sons of God who married daughters of men giving offspring of giants , Genesis 6:1-8. God says he has never called any angles his son, Hebrew 1:4-5.When were fallen angles redeemed and sanctified to be called sons? The ownership of daughters is unto multiplied men who were referred to as sons of God and the lust to polygamous marriage was with men. Are beautiful daughters born today for men? Shall we have another episode of fallen angles marrying daughters of men before the close of age? Many have taught the Word of God outside Biblical doctrines so many are deceived in their teaching and preaching which condemn God as unjust since no judgment is passed to angles they refer to as sons of God. When men dropped further from grace when they practiced polygamous marriage and their life span was reduced to one hundred and twenty years , no judgment is passed to purposed angles they teach us sons of God. The sons of God were men who had done reconciliation to God the same way Abel had done and was accepted by God. The judgment is specifically to mankind and giants born in sin of polygamous marriage do not qualify the sons of God to be angles. God said His spirit shall not always strive with man and He saw the wickedness of man was great. This time there is no wickedness associated with angles, Genesis6:1–7 . Angles are ministering spirits with no reproductive empowerment, Matthew 22:29-32, Hebrew 1:14-14.
Our relationship to God our Father is in love in our loyal priesthood to the world. Roman 8:14-17. Only those who are not sincere mix teaching under carnal law and spiritual teaching enlightenment under spiritual law. When we study the old covenant it should help us get rooted deeply in the new covenant. The devil uses the nobles, evil and false witness to do his will according to circumstances, Acts 13;50-51 Acts 6: 9-14. Christians must remain wise and not be cheated by devils workers transforming themselves as angles of light which corrupt the Word of God, 2Corinthians2:17, 2Corinthians11: 13-15. Levites Pastor, Priests and some Christians misquote Jesus Christ on judgment. Judge not that you may be not judged . Matthew7:1-5. They say God prohibit judgment which is not true since it is based on taking the scripture out of content and contest on understanding Jesus statement. It has given them a highway of teaching lies without being questioned. They have separated themselves from the body of Christ to ideal entity who cannot be censured. Shall you close your eyes to evils committed that they may not judge you. Do you buy yourself freedom from being judged for not condemning evil or commenting on anything positive or negative. The preaching of the Word of God is based on judgment on sins and righteousness . God requires from us righteous judgment in wisdom and in love which condemn sins which leads man to repentant of sins and redemption. The Word of God in its content and contest states judgment on sins and righteousness. Christians are saved by grace in Christ’s love and our judgment must remain under Spiritual law of love in Grace that leads to redemption and under perfect law of liberty to do righteousness in Christ love, James 1:20-25, James2:10-26. Thus to him that knows to do good in liberty and does not do it is sin to him, James 4:15 Bro James taught us to avoid judgment under carnal law that brings condemnation without redemption. Those who live under law shall face judgment without mercy for no man shall be justified by the works of the law,Galatians2:16-21 . All living beings and organic life are in constant judgment for existent. If we can stop all processes of judgments life will come to a standstill and ultimate death with final judgment of decay. Life and all creation were established in good judgment by God and close of age shall end in judgment to eternal life or eternal death which is eternal life of suffering and separation from God. Genesis 1:1-31, Genesis 2:1-25. Even our bodies judge us out of energy and we hunger for food and thirst for water. All witty discoveries are results of acknowledgment of positive judgments on well active coordinated principals. Christians are encouraged to solve cases in judgment among themselves. 1Corinthians 6:1-7,The Bible encourages us that our love may abound yet more in knowledge and in all Judgment and we judge ourselves dead in Christ, 2 Corinthians5:14 ,Philippians 1:9-12. Life is in active constant judgments and the creation mourns for final judgment which it shall be subjected by God. We relate in evaluation to all things in judgment. What we known and do not know is based on judgment. What we believe right or wrong is based on judgment. Irrespective of any judgment delivered on us we should deliver the Heavenly Kingdom judgment to sins. We saved Christians are counted and judged worthy to suffer tribulations together with Christ when we live Christian life in love ,Revelation Chapter1,2 and3. We thus judge ourselves dead to sin in Christ Jesus. We cannot stop delivering Heavenly Judgments to buy ourselves freedom from being judged. Without sense of judgmental evaluation of good, evil or bad would never exist for humanity and humanity would enter into a void valueless state in life. Even when others say do not judge others , that statement bear judgment in itself. Our appreciation is in judgment.
There are may be those who preach tithing to saved Christians for lack of spiritual understanding. We should girdle up the loins of our minds as the knowledgeable wise sharers of the Word of God . 1Peter :13-15.Roman 10:1-4. We shall be off the hook of being soothed ,cornered, and been cheated on doctrinal issue in Christianity. God bless us in abundant grace of spiritual revelation and spiritual understanding of His Holy Word, Colssians1:9-14, Ephesians 5:6 -7,1Thessalonians 2:3-6, 2Timothy2:15, 2Timothy 2:24-26 . Amen I am happily blessed to interact with you on spiritual teachings. Hope we shall search more scriptures for our beneficial spiritual growth . Yearning to receive your input on the topic .God bless you.
The message is freely given purely to the body of JESUS CHRIST worldwide.
By Br. Robert Munyui Kamunyu
[…] WHY I LEFT THE WORD OF FAITH AND RHEMA by John Edwards […]
Know you just made your sefe a new Colt I believe God Opens door to the eyes of your understanding in different ways for one is this way to another that way so who can say you right and they wrong I believe you can be right and wrong in many ways
God said “Try the spirits and see if they be of God.” He tried Word of Faith as well as myself and many others. GOD opened our eyes and now we clearly see they are not of God. God led me to LEAVE WOF forever before I even read Mr. Edwards testimony. I’m very familiar with WOF. Everything he says about them is accurate and they simply ARE WRONG. Please pray to be more discerning because your spiritual awareness is off. We can’t afford to turn a blind eye to wrong doing in the church. It will lead you destruction every time.
@Rose walters and @Bonita1973,
So true Bonita. The thing about WOF that appeals to the unregenerated human spirit is the selfishness of it all. What can God do for ME if I have faith? I’ve read others here like Rose still entrapped in this kind of worldly misinterpretation say over and over and over vigorously defend WOF saying “Well, it works for ME!” THAT’S the problem. It’s not supposed to work for you. It’s supposed to work IN you and change you. And you can tell if it is working in you when you become less worldly and more Godly. That will never happen in WOF because it encourages worldliness. I can’t tell you how many times my ex-WOF pastor would spend entire church meeting times devoted to “getting God to act on your behalf”. He would say “if you’ve been believing God for the manifestation of a car or a spouse or a better job (or anything), come up here!” I got so tired of hearing it all. What’s in it for me? That’s the crux of the WOF message. It’s not about God at all.
But clearly not everyone has ears to hear nor eyes to see. Their message sounds benign but it’s ultimately damning. It leads the “believer” to think he is saved when he is not.
Would you like to start a different kind of church?
1. Structure: the structure of My Dream Church is based on the New Testament ‘Body Of Christ’ model and not on the Old Testament hierarchical model.
2. Anointing: Every believer is a priest in the new covenant.
3. Biblical: submission to the Word in My Dream Church will be at a higher level than submission to leaders
4. Leaders should have secular jobs:
5. Finances: Giving not Tithing. Transparency in finances.
6. Praise and Worship is congregational:
7. Looking sideways (practical love):
see more at https://sites.google.com/site/mydreamchurch/
Why not do something worthwhile with your time instead of beratting another.USE YOUR TIME WISELY.This is complete error.
It is just sad that this man has been robbed and lied to by the enemy! God does not get any glory by his suffering and lack. God is a good God, a better father than our earthly fathers. God does not glory in the sickness of his children. What good father would! I have lived the word, confessing what his word says about me and it works when you BELIEVE it! Faith is the key that unlocks the promises of God! ” Daughter, thy FAITH has made thee whole”!
U need to remove this why do u attack Rhema? It’s not of God. U are in error…
This accomplishes nothing. It’s nothing- ness.
I think and as you know we shouldn’t judge, you couldn’t make it so you judged others who are truly spirit driven walk in faith every day. They preach God’s word exactly as it is written and continue to go deeper in the word and suddenly a new word of understanding is revealed. Our faith in God is the most important thing to Him. Most preachers aren’t doing it for them selves but to get people saved and take their eyes off the world and on the word of God and the sacrifice he made so we might be saved. The about our Lord & Saviour is He was wholey God and Wholey man and he said he did only what his Father said he should do. Jesus himself called Him Seft Son of Man..This is just an observation but many people unconsciously go into the ministry with eyes on the earthly things and not on God’s Word and unconditional love and then criticing those that truly love the Lord and work hard to bring people to God part of the great commission. I am just offering up a reason for what a teenage girl might say when everything had to be someone else’s fault stick out their bottom lip and go stamping back home to have a good cry while listening to sad songs. No Judgement on my part just an observation.
Hey folks,
The Bible says, by GRACE we are SAVED through Faith……..what comes first? Grace comes first. Grace provides salvation but that salvation cannot come without faith. God says, He has given grace to all men but are all men and women saved? NOOOOOO. Why? because they do not have faith to receive what grace has provided.
After we receive salvation, the Bible says, the old has gone and the new has come and that new that has come, God says, the just shall live by faith. live your entire life by faith (believing God by His word).
The problem is this, everyone claims to have faith but James says, what does it profit man to say you have faith and you do not put to works….it will not profit you.
How do you faith to work? God says in Hebrews, Hold fast your confession that you may enter into the rest of God and James goes on to say, make your request in faith and doubt not.
when Jesus sent the disciples to go heal the a young girl……they came back when the girl had not healed and Jesus told them……..it is because of your unbelief.
Failing to see what God has promised is because of your unbelief spirit but not because God is a liar.
No one can walk by faith unless they have a true revelation of the one they put their faith in.
Friends, I think we need to be very serious and know God.
The problem is you make your request today and repeat it tomorrow and the other day and till you see the answer but that is very wrong. make your request in faith and do not doubt……..meaning. Request God for the daughter’s healing according to His promise of healing and believe she has healed. stop going to God making requests. That is not faith….it is doubting, unbelief. Believe she has been healed and just thank Him even when healing has not manifested.
If you want to get to me for further study on how God wants you to respond to Him in Faith reach me on krysonuganda@gmail.com
Chris Mubiru
Pastor John you are so on the money. I’m one that JESUS/HOLY GHOST/GOD is the creator of everything HE will have mercy on whom HE will, it is HIS WORD that heals who ever HE chooses If I truly belong to JESUS CHRIST it’s HIS WILL I want for my life. Look at Hezekiah he changed GOD’S MIND got 15 more years here. In that 15 years he got farther from GOD than he had all his life. I personally choose to set my mind on giving up my right to myself and this life, I want JESUS CHRIST to be in charge of ALL my Circumstances because HE knows what my Circumstances need to show HIS GLORY THROUGH the likes of me. Without JESUS CHRIST we are LOST.
thinking about Jacobs dream about the lather stretching into heaven.
The angels they were not subject to the steps of the lather.
but ascended and descended .
they were not subject to each step if you love me keep my commands my sheep hear my Voice why do you call me Lord Lord and do not do what I say
If you believe in the policies of the particular government your voting for them. They say if you like what our policy is saying then get your butt down to the voting station and cast your vote for us
So you become obedient so you do what they say
Jesus is the exact same way do you like his policies ( Mercy )Of forgiveness for your brothers and my favourite repentance
Remember the subject is not about legalism or fundamentalism neither radicalism or of any lism.
I believe that to become a True believer each step has to be taken just like the lather
Jesus is the Lord Jesus is the lather in the dream to get to the father you must go through me
Jesus is the door we cannot claim in any other way
Most people and maybe a lot of people myself included like to run up to the lather and Jump missing the essential steps
Once again I reiterate I am not talking about legalism fundamentalism or any of lism
There is a lot to say on the subject but the point I’m making is the lather we must respect Jesus and put into practice what he tells us to do repent even Believer repent every day that’s why it’s our race if you buried your Old man in baptism you need to consider what that really means me included
reckon your cells dead in Christ
That’s the endgame there folks
If you don’t know what this means you may still be living in your old man subject to their looking at the latter but not claim on the lather we are not running in a race
A lather has to be claimed properly .
Consequences could be misunderstanding scripture missingapplying scripture (confusion others)
blaming God blame in churches families friends but not ourselves
When we look at a lather just jump up there.
That’s the nature we have it’s a bigger problem you may believe it’s always been the problem but we don’t tend to look that it
We are okay I am doing my prayers am working in God’s love
I’m not hurting anybody I’m not fighting with everybody and reading my bible am going to church regularly
I help out at church doing what needs doing.
Folks I encourage you to take the first step on the ladder.
Our nature like to manifest itself through pride
I’ve got a piece of paper that says I’m smarter than you
I’ve got a few pennies more than you in the bank you should look up to me
I dress better so you should look up to me
Because I am part of a certain organisation you should treat me with respect even if I am corrupt
many like it many more manifestations of pride
We don’t judge people who think that way we forgive them for they do not know what they do
Pride is very closely linked to discrimination
To put it in short sentence discrimination is judging others when you do not know them actually that sentence is not correct discrimination is judging people by what they wear how they talk who are they associate with what they believe
Do not judge for measure you judge was the same will be given to you been out this evening folks God is not murked we will reap what we so
If we humble ourselves under the mighty hand of God
To me this means we have to acknowledge that we don’t know what to do we don’t know how to take that step on the ladder we need help Lord
The Lord helps those humble themselves
Some Scriptures
God resists the proud and gives grace to the humble
God sustains the humble and cast The wicked to the ground
Ps mercy and peace ho love obedience.
forgive me for any spelling errors
And all the grammar issues
I am working on it
Y
I’m a 1986 graduate of RBTC. All of you that despise WOF have missed the most important point. WOF all leads to Jesus and the Word of God. It should make us better servants to the world and the body of Christ. It should help us walk more as Jesus did. There is no doubt that some WOF preachers have gotten into error but so have others from EVERY denomination. I am willing to debate any of you, including John, about Word of Faith and what they teach. As far as Kenneth Hagin’s teachings, I believe they were right on. Copeland and some of the other WOF’ers have taught some good stuff but have also taught some weird stuff. Hagin was a stickler for the Word, All of us should be too! The reason most Christians get into trouble or get deceived is because they don’t check the Word out for themselves. They follow men and not the Word. If you have been deceived by a preacher (WOF, Baptist, Methodist or whatever) blame yourself for following that man instead of God’s Word!
Mr.Edwards I was just wondering when did you get saved and tell us about what ed.
Wow
You have taken your time to point out all that is wrong about the word of faith movement.
I wish you had a lens that big to check yourself out to find out indeed what kind of gospel you have come to believe and teach.
You seem to me a confused fellow, God bless your heart.
I would love someone to call me 870-219-5900
Tourniquet addressed the Word of Faith Movement in the song A Dog’s Breakfast as some Assembly of God churches borrowed from this movement in their sermons. When I attended Faith World Outreach they cited the teachings of Mark Barclay; a blogger who read an entry I did laying into the King James Only Movement asked me if I read about Mark Barclay. I had taken aim at the blab-it-and-grab-it movement in some short stories as I would address televangelists who do this as Johnny Miracle who have a Bible in one hand and fecal matter in the other. What these churches have in common with the Independent Baptist movement is they preach Biblical Literallism and claim the earth is 6000 years old — when I took philosophy I was able to challenge both movements as I would present philosophical arguments such as take God and Satan out of the question, and answer what is the nature of evil.